How much does the 2619 really weigh?

[rcase13]

I am looking at buying the 2619 and towing it with a 2011 Honda Pilot 4WD. The tow rating is 4500lbs with a 450lb tongue limit. The Pilot has a 109" wheel base. I want to be well within the numbers and keep my small family safe.

Since TrailManor won't give real weights (especially tongue) can someone tell me what the 2619 weighs with the following:

2619
A/C
Awning
Full Propane
Batteries

We only camp where there is power and water so we will tow with the gray, black and fresh water tanks empty.

I can measure my "stuff" myself but really need to know what the tongue weight of the 2619 is with the above options.

If I missed a link to real weights on the TrailManor website please direct me to it.

 

[Bill]

Well, let's start with one thing. Trailmanor does give "real weight" of the trailer. It is called dry weight, and it is the real weight of the TM before the owner adds stuff, including factory options. At the Trailmanor.com website, click "Showroom", then "Specifications" - the dry weight is listed for every model of folding trailer.

Trailmanor does not list the weight of factory options, but you can look them up. Without looking them up, I would guess that the air conditioner weighs 60 pounds, the awning weighs 30 pounds, a battery weighs 25 pounds, and propane weighs 25 pounds (5 pounds per gallon or so). Total about 150 pounds.

What TrailManor can't list, and can't control, is the stuff that the owner adds. The TM web site suggests that you should add 500 to 1000 pounds to the dry weight to obtain a ready-to-camp weight, and as you can see, the factory options are a relatively small part of this. You can figure that the tongue weight is 13-14% of the total towed weight.

I hope this helps. I'm not entirely sure what you expect TM to publish as a "real weight". Your concern with weight is commendable, but most of the gap between dry weight and towed weight is under your control, not TM's.

Bill

 

[rcase13]

Thanks my biggest issue is with the tongue weight. Before spending $30,000 dollars I want to be sure how much the tongue weight will increase. With three people and gear my Pilot tongue weight limit drops to 400lbs. Do you think I will be below this with 500lbs worth of gear loaded in the TM?

Dumb question but I am a newbie in the prospective owner thread so hopefully dumb questions can be tollerated here somewhat. Can we load that 500lbs of cargo more towards the rear of the TM and reduce the tongue weight some? I am not concerned with the trailer weight I am well within limits on that.

Thanks for the measurements I will do some research on the weight of full propane tanks. That worries me as those sit right near the hitch.

I realize TM can't guess at what I carry but they should spec tongue weight with wet weights and all options. It wouldn't be that hard and it would make for a safer experience.

As it stands I think I am borderline with my tongue weight. In my opinon there is no way a vehicle that only has a 350/3500 towing capability can safely tow these trailers. Yet they clearly advertise them doing it. Nobody tows a dry trailer.

 

[mjlaupp]

In my opinon there is no way a vehicle that only has a 350/3500 towing capability can safely tow these trailers. Yet they clearly advertise them doing it. Nobody tows a dry trailer.

Yes, but you can tow a dry trailer and therein lies the loophole!

Mike

 

[mjlaupp]

If I missed a link to real weights on the TrailManor website please direct me to it.

There are no "real weights" on the TM website other than some dry out the door weights for the Elkmonts. If you can get to a TM dealer, you should find the dry weight of this TM with factory options and liquid adders posted on the inside of the cabinet doors under the sink.

Mike

 

[rcase13]

Thanks Mike I guess I need to head to a dealer and take the Pilot with me.

I'm afraid if i go I will buy it... Not much will power...

 

[Kevin Krause]

A couple of thoughts since you seem mostly concerned about tongue weight. 1) Looking at photos, the AC seems to be located above or near the axel, it probably does not contribute to tongue weight much. The awning, although mostly forward of the axel probably does not contribute much to tongue weight either. I would be mostly concerned about the propane, and wonder if anyone has taken just one bottle on shorter trips. 2) A weight distributing hitch (WDH) does exactly that, it redistibutes the weight. It puts more weight onto the trailer axel and the front wheels of the tow vehicle. I would search threads on WDH for more information. 3) Be careful about putting weight behind the trailer axel as a solution. Tongue weight is the best solution for trailer sway. So you end up performing a balancing act (pun intended). Too little tongue weight and you get trailer sway, too much exceeds your vehicle capacity.

 

[M&M Hokie]

I weighed a fully loaded (including full hot/fresh water) 2720 and it came in at 3980. I failed to do a tongue weight measurement then. However, if you adjust my weight by the difference in dry weights listed on the TM website between a 2720 and a 2619 and figure I had about 40-50 pounds of stuff in the extra storage that you wouldn't have, it ought to give you a decent first approximation. My config included all optional cabinets, the awning, the air conditioner, 40-gal water tank, dual propane, and two 6V batteries. I also had things like folding lawn chairs and a pop-up shade thing in there. I weighed the extras like the chairs, pop-up, cabinets, etc so I could give you more data if you want it.

 

[cochise-TMO]

TrailManor marketing

There is a lot of confusion about weight in the TrailManor series of trailers. I have an Elkmont 24, where the weight does not make any sense. How so?
TrailManor advertise the weight as 2498 lb with 320 on the tongue. We purchased it and on the way home from Texas to Arizona, found that it was probably not correct. We had the trailer weighed on a public certified truck scale in Tucson. The result: The trailer axle weighed 3540 lb. The tongue weight was 590 lb. And we had nothing in the trailer. The title told us that the shipping weight was 2730 lb. The axle is a Dexter Torflex single axle with a weight limit of 3500 lb, yet the sticker (Federally mandated) states a GAWR of 3619 lb.

Confronted with all these different numbers, TrailManor has given me several explanations. The weight of the AC, the weight of the electric jack, the awning etc. BUT all of this was installed at the factory, and the title states shipping weight of 2730 lb.

Bill (moderator) gives the weight of the LP gas tanks as about 20 lb, but they weigh more like 40 lb filled, so that is 80 lb more on the tongue. I called each of the manufacturers of the "extras" my trailer was equipped with and got a total of about 185 lb, which is what Bill also arrived at. That brings us to an approximate total of 2700 lb, in accordance with the title. However Mr. Hulsey at TM told me that that was a misunderstanding, as mis-print, and that the weight would be more, and that I did not understand the "industry standards". Well I am a customer, and when I ask questions about towing and other items, I expect to get an honest answer. That did not happen!

One more thing, since the max weight of the axle is 3500 lb and the GAWR is 3619, if I ever had an accident and filed a claim, the insurance company would probably deny that claim based on the weight discrepancy, this according to a phone call to the Insurance Information Institute.

So since the 2619 is a single axle trailer and the give the dry weight as 2673 lb, it is probably a lot more, thus I would be very very cautious about that.

 

[gocntry]

Here Is The Sticker From My 08 2720.... This Weight Includes Ac/Awning/2 Hanging Cabinets/Microwave Drawer/Amplified Antenna/Swing Hitch..That Gives Me An Empty Weight Of 3095 Lbs. And That's Not Including The 1 Or 2 Batteries That Will Be Installed. It Includes The Propane Tanks Empty, Add More Weight When You Fill Them

 

[rcase13]

Thanks that means the 2619 would weigh about 200lbs less than that.

3095-200=2895+40 (propane)=2935 I do not plan on towing with water. No boondocking for us. Must have power for AC! I figure the additon of batteries would be offset by me not having the cabinets.

I weigh all our crap (chairs, grill, food, cooler, bedding and cloths) and it's about 300lbs. We tend to pack pretty light. That would put me at 3235. Does this sound about right? Is this what others with 2619s top out at?

Using the 13% tongue weight math from above puts the tongue weight at 420lbs. That is about 20lbs too much according to the Honda's manual with three people and their gear.

Is there such a thing as a WDH that will offset only 20lbs off that number? Or should I just shift stuff towards the back to offset that amount?

Thanks for all the replies this newbie really appreciates it.

 

[cochise-TMO]

Your trailer is a single axle trailer, which means that there is way more weight on the tongue than the normal 10-15%. But consider this: On the rear left side of the trailer you should find a sticker that list among other things the following: GVWR and GAWR. The GVWR list the max allowable weight of the trailer and the GVWR list the max load on the axle. If GAWR is greater than your axle max capacity you loose.

And if you move stuff to the rear of the trailer you put more weight on the axle. Even with a WDH you'll likely have more weight on the rear of the TV than is allowable, plus it can seriously diminish the steering of the TV. And the dealer will probably tell you that you are ok. Texas RV told me that and the fact was that we were way over capacity, and lucky to make it 1000 miles back without incident. Remember that they make money selling these units. Once you are out the door they don't really care.

 

[rcase13]

Your trailer is a single axle trailer, which means that there is way more weight on the tongue than the normal 10-15%. But consider this: On the rear left side of the trailer you should find a sticker that list among other things the following: GVWR and GAWR. The GVWR list the max allowable weight of the trailer and the GVWR list the max load on the axle. If GAWR is greater than your axle max capacity you loose.

And if you move stuff to the rear of the trailer you put more weight on the axle. Even with a WDH you'll likely have more weight on the rear of the TV than is allowable, plus it can seriously diminish the steering of the TV. And the dealer will probably tell you that you are ok. Texas RV told me that and the fact was that we were way over capacity, and lucky to make it 1000 miles back without incident. Remember that they make money selling these units. Once you are out the door they don't really care.

Is there a thread where people have posted their real world 2619 weight numbers including tongue weights?

 

[Redhawk]

I expect to have our 2619 out next week if you can weight that long. LOL..I'm funny.
I'll try and get some numbers then at a local scale. A WDH will be a must I would think.
I would be as concerned with the TV's GCWR too. That said, I understand where you're coming from. THe TM's are a lot of fun and can be addicting.

 

[ZekenSpider]

The attached .pdf file is my accumulation of information posted by other TM owners about their real world loaded and unloaded TM weights compared to the factory advertised weights. Unfortunately, there is only one posting for a 2619 but maybe you can extrapolate from the other models listed.

Jerry

 

[PopBeavers]

I weighed a fully loaded (including full hot/fresh water) 2720 and it came in at 3980. I failed to do a tongue weight measurement then. However, if you adjust my weight by the difference in dry weights listed on the TM website between a 2720 and a 2619 and figure I had about 40-50 pounds of stuff in the extra storage that you wouldn't have, it ought to give you a decent first approximation. My config included all optional cabinets, the awning, the air conditioner, 40-gal water tank, dual propane, and two 6V batteries. I also had things like folding lawn chairs and a pop-up shade thing in there. I weighed the extras like the chairs, pop-up, cabinets, etc so I could give you more data if you want it.

Interesting.

According to all the documentation I have read, a TM 2720 has an axle limit of 3,500 pounds. Either TM has upgraded the axle on newer models or you are overweight.

 

[robertkennel]

My 2008 2720sl axle states 3500 max excluding rims. I don't understand then why does the sticker on the left side display GAWR 3640. The GVWR is 4217 even if you minus 500 pounds of tongue weight it seems the axle could be overloaded if you go to the GVWR. I hope someone can explain this to me. I'm sure there is an explanation. I'm hoping to weigh the trailer tomorrow.

 

[M&M Hokie]

Interesting.

According to all the documentation I have read, a TM 2720 has an axle limit of 3,500 pounds. Either TM has upgraded the axle on newer models or you are overweight.

I was certainly close to it on that particular day back in August but I didn't weigh axle and tongue separately to see how the load was distributed.

The GVWR for my TM is 4166 lbs and the GAWR is 3640 lbs.

Now that I have a new TV, I am going to load both the TV and TM up and go do a nice axle-by-axle science project over at the base scale. I would like to compare things with the WDH at various levels of loading. (It is nice to have access to a free scale) I may opt to eliminate the WDH altogether.

I am thinking that the following weighings would capture a lot of meaningful data.

TV Only: Front Axle, Rear Axle
TV+TM with No Tension on WDH: Front Axle, Rear Axle, TM Axle
TV+TM with 2 loose links on WDH: Front Axle, Rear Axle, TM Axle
TV+TM with 4 loose links on WDH: Front Axle, Rear Axle, TM Axle

For each configuration I will also measure the fender heights on the TV to capture how it sags under the various load configurations.

Any further suggestions on how I could tweak the the experiment to maximize information return?

 

[robertkennel]

It will be interesting to see how much weight the WDH adds to the front axle and to the trailer axle and removes from the rear axle, thanks in advance for doing the test. Robert

 

[ZekenSpider]

TM (with the blessing of Dexter Axle) has changed the way it calculates the Gross Axle Weight Ratings (GAWR). It is now 3,500# plus the weight of tires, rims & drums (items that are not carried by the axle). The axle is still limited to carry only 3,500#, but when you weigh the TM, the scale sees the TM on top of the axle plus the left and right side tires, rims & drums that carry the axle. This total of both values is 3,640# (3,500# + 70# + 70#).

If you weigh the TM with the axle only on the scale (with the hitch load not on the scale) and you see more than 3,640#, you are overweight on the axle. The scale reading will also include any weight transferred to the TM axle by the WDH if it is active.

In the case of the TM 3326K it is still 3,640# per axle or 7,280# with both axles on the scale. That, however would exceed the TM 3326 GVWR of 5,070#.

Jerry