2417 (2013) Solar Conversion

[LorenzoNM]

Bought a 2013 2417 last year, used a few times, now adding solar and LiFePo4 batteries.

Starting with 4x100W (in series) de-mountable rigid panels, and building a system in an aluminum tongue box: Victron 50A 100V MPPT controller, 3x100Ah batteries and a 3000W pure sine inverter.

- In order to replace the AGM battery with the LiFePo4 bank (3x100Ah),
it looks like I need a DC-DC converter to charge the batteries while towing?(I'm thinking of using the Renogy DC-DC 30A unit)

When boon docking, I plan to plug the shore power cord into the 3000W pure sine inverter.

I do not plan to turn the 3000W inverter in except when running a microwave or other large load.

- Can I easily run 12-14V directly (fused) from the lithium batts directly to the fuse block of the power panel of the WF-8955?

- Can someone please explain how the auto-switch off of battery power occurs when shore power is connected?

- I'm thinking I will disconnect (or install a switch) to be able to shut off the original inverter from 12V inside the WF-8955.

Comments? Questions? etc?

Thank you!

 

[Shane826]

I’m confused about your use of the inverter. Why would you plug shore power into the inverter?

Your TM doesn’t have an original inverter. It has a CONverter which will switch 120VAC to 12VDC to charge the battery when plugged in to shore power.

You will also want to swap out your converter/charger to a unit with lithium charging strategy.

 

[jagizzi]

There is no switching off DC power when you are plugged in to shore power. Think of it as if you are always running the DC circuits off of the battery, directly when you are not charging (shorepower or solar) or indirectly using the charging sources when they are active, either shorepower or solar.

 

[jagizzi]

You should be able to directly connect the batteries to the charging circuit of the 8955. The manual for the unit will give details as to how best to make that connection.

With regards to your inverter cabling, pay very close attention to the current needs on the DC portions of that circuit. 3000W is nearly 300A of current and the cables will need to be sized accordingly.

 

[jagizzi]

You are not going to want to plug shorepower into your inverter. this is where things get a bit complicated and answers depend on what you are trying to power with the inverter. Do some searching in this forum, and online, for solar wiring diagrams and find one with an inverter. You will most likely see a transfer switch in the mix which is something that you might need to install, again, depending on how you want this all to work.

 

[LorenzoNM]

Thank you for the rapid response and input!

I am powering the new seconday 3000W inverter with the lithium batteries so I can run 1500 microwave or brief Air Conditioning (1350W) when boondocking. Yes I am feeding the inverter with 4/0 AWG from a battery cutoff switch and have large AWG wires from each battery negative terminal.
Each battery also separately fused upstream of the battery positive cutoff switch.

Just told by WFCO tech support to make sure the circuit breaker to the primary (factory) inverter is shut off when running seconday inverter.
I can trace it our, but does someone already know which breaker?
From top down on the WF-8955PEC my breakers are:
30A (main)
1st dual 20A
2nd dual 20A
single 20A

Thank you!

 

[Shane826]

There still is no factory inverter on a TrailManor.

 

[jagizzi]

Are you sure that you have an inverter onboard currently? Having two isn't anything I have put much thought into. If there is a small one already it might be easiest to just remove it.

 

[jagizzi]

So, your breakers:

Main is as it sounds, basically allows power to flow into the breaker panel to the other breakers, at least on my 2720.
20A no clue which one but one is your converter, the WF8955. This is both your battery charger and the 12V supply for all of the trailer
20A One is your AC. You can figure out which one by setting the AC to on and then flipping breakers on until the AC actually turns on
20A Another one would be for the outlets, and you still need the fridge in there somewhere, and the microwave and the water heater. Not sure how you are wired

You will have to flip breakers looking for what turns off or on to see what they are hooked up to, and then label them. Note that I have 6 breakers so that the everything gets its own breaker. I simply installed the double breakers into the positions that held singles, easy peasy to them move the wires to the new breakers.

 

[rickst29]

You will need a 'transfer switch' for this:

When boon docking, I plan to plug the shore power cord into the 3000W pure sine inverter.

You will need a 'transfer switch' to prevent "shore power" Inverter output from reaching 120-VAC appliances at the same time -
unless you are are speaking of a very expensive all-in-one Victron Multiplus II unit, an Inverter converts 12V into a 120-VAC while generating its own 60-cycle frequency.

A simple inverter must never have live "shore power" connected to it's 120V output ports, because the 60-cycle shore power frequency is not "in phase" with the 60-cycle frequency being generated by the Inverter. The Inverter will be destroyed, and other 120-VAC equipment (air conditioner power converter, etc) wi8ll probably be destroyed at the same time. The problem could continue back through the RV park pole and damage equipment in other sites.
- - -
A transfer switch assures that only one of two feeding pairs of "hot" + "neitral return" wires is active into the TM's 120-VAC circuit breaker set at a time. If you are not installing a Multiplus, you will need one of those.

 

[rickst29]

Renogy "30A" or "40A" could melt the TM bargeman cord.

I didn't know that they even make a "30A", but that's too much current (and will damage the bargeman cord, usually melting at one of the connectors into the 7-way plug.

Do not exceed 20A, that size is probably alright.

 

[rickst29]

Why three "100Ah" batteries?

A single battery pack built with 280-300Ah cells would need only one BMS, and would provide for simpler wiring.

 

[LorenzoNM]

Solar system with Shore cord plugged into 3KW inverter

Calrification:
I mean plugging the shore cord into the 3KW inverter as a susbstitute for shore power when boondocking.

 

[LorenzoNM]

Why 3 100 Ah batteries?

A single battery pack built with 280-300Ah cells would need only one BMS, and would provide for simpler wiring.

Reasons:
1. A reasonable price on Amazon for LiTime Mini 100Ah unit with built-in BMS.
2. Started thinking 200 Ah would be adequate, then decided I want at least 300 Ah after talking to boondocking friends.

 

[rickst29]

Reasons:
1. A reasonable price on Amazon for LiTime Mini 100Ah unit with built-in BMS.
2. Started thinking 200 Ah would be adequate, then decided I want at least 300 Ah after talking to boondocking friends.

They advertise "up to 15000 cycles," I'd stop looking at that one right there.

The BMS apparently doesn't have bluetooth / cellphone ;programming and monitor control.

 

[larsdennert]

I didn't know that they even make a "30A", but that's too much current (and will damage the bargeman cord, usually melting at one of the connectors into the 7-way plug.

Do not exceed 20A, that size is probably alright.

Bargmans are usually fused at 30A just as the TM main battery is and #10 wire is generally utilized.

Another thing to watch is having the LiPos going to an inverter, plugged into the shore power lead, supplying the TM Converter trying to charge the LiPos.