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Old 02-05-2014, 04:22 PM   #1
woodlandcottage
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Default About to check out two 2619's

One is an hour away at an RV dealer, with cosmetic hail damage, 2009 priced $15K and one is at a local TM dealer, 2005 good shape inside and out with a tentative price of about $13K(this will depend on several factors once the TM dealership gets a good look at all the systems).
A quick look-up on NADA values says that the 2009 is priced only a couple thousand above average retail, which is consistent with our state. I've been watching prices for almost a year now. But the dealership knows next to nothing about the unit or TM in general. I know a fair amount but things like age of the tires and salvage/standard titling were things the dealer couldn't tell me. We plan to go up to see that one on Saturday and hopefully he will have dug up that info.
The NADA value for the 2005 is only about $6500. I do know that this dealership is very well known for including everything in the price to get the TM operating like new. Their reputation is stellar both before and after a sale. But at almost twice the average retail? The dealer wants me to put down a refundable deposit for right of first refusal. I won't get a chance to look at it for two weeks. But I have a feeling that even if I love it and think the condition is fantastic, I wouldn't go higher than $9K on a 2005. Am I being stingy? I want to be fair and pay for the services they would provide but it's hard for me to guess what those will be and how much they are worth.
At this point we have been searching every week, 3 models that would work for our family, for 6 months. We search all the major online RV sellers, all our regional Craiglist ads, and all our semi-local RV dealership websites. Most of the ones I see posted online are sold before I get a chance to see them. The 5 or so we've seen privately were in poor shape or had iffy modifications. The ones on the lot are priced way over NADA. Our search radius is one day's drive(about 400 miles)so it would be feasible to pick up on a three day weekend. We asked the TM dealership to call us whenever they had one of our desired models in our price range. We finally got a call. :/
My husband just want to throw caution to the wind and just buy one, then repent over the expense at leisure. I manage our finances and am the one who has done all the research so I'm not too keen on that idea. It seems to me, the best option between these two is to buy the 2009 and fix anything that needs fixing. We could spend several thousand bucks on the repairs and come out way ahead of the older model. The hail damage was probably going to happen anyway since most of the places we would camp get such storms often. There are no garages when you are out camping.
What would you be thinking about the prices of these two, before you even went to look at them? How much can I reasonably bid below asking?
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Old 02-05-2014, 05:20 PM   #2
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Looks like you've got a good handle of the situation. Your right, that 2005 model is priced out of line. I wouldn't care if they served me champagne and caviar for that price.... I'm not overpaying like that. Have you seen photos of the 2009 unit? As far as hail damage? I to realize that it may happen somewhere in its life but I hate to start out with that type of cosmetic issues. I also realize the roof issue only shows when it's stored down. And for me, the title would need to clear meaning not salvage. I would not be comfortable with an insurance loss vehicle. Dealer would need to demonstrate all mechanical, electrical, components in person. Run the heater, AC, water pump, refrigerator on all 3 phases, interior condition used but in very good condition, no rips, tears, stains, flooring does not have any weak or soft subfloor, and absolutely no water leaks....

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Old 02-05-2014, 10:39 PM   #3
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Hmmm. I looked at a TM that had been totaled by the insurance company, due to hail. If I had been in the market for that size, I would have no problem purchasing the unit with the damage, as it was really not "bad", in my mind. The aspect of a salvage title, though, would add a different dimension.

I have not dealt with a salvage title, so my comments are not based on experience. But, seems to me that a salvage title would warrant maybe half of the price of a unit in good condition, even if it is only hail damage. I would call my insurance agent, and ask about insuring it, with a salvage title. If it was totaled, again, what would I get from the insurance company? If they say $8,000, I would not pay $15,000.

Negotiate, after talking to your insurance agent. That, to me, would be a good indicator of what I should be offering. Don't have a clue how much the dealership paid the old insurance company, but my guess is that it was not within $2,000 of current asking price.

Again, I have no experience with a salvage title, so my comments are just my personal take on the situation.

Good luck!
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Old 02-06-2014, 05:42 AM   #4
moneeleann
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I think that NADA values are kind of useless when it comes to Trailmanor. If a unit has been well kept, you're not going to see prices below 5000, even for a 2000 unit.

With that said, I paid 6500 for my 2005 3023. I got it at that price because of roof damage and a leaking roof, and torsion bar problems. Not hail damage. I spent a lot of time, effort, and money fixing that roof. If I sold it now, with everything repaired, I would expect to get 9-10K out of it.

I do think the dealer may be overcharging for the 2005, but then, it's a dealer, they are making a profit, and like you said, no clue what they're doing to it. 9000, like you said, wouldn't be unreasonable. The 2009 actually seems to be at a fairly decent price. Similar to many I've seen here. I think Trailmanor holds its worth more than the NADA guides say, in my opinion.
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Old 02-06-2014, 05:55 PM   #5
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Paid 10,500 for a 2005 2619 in excellent condition in 2011. Have had no problems with it.
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Old 02-06-2014, 09:38 PM   #6
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I would focus on the 2009 assuming the damage is only cosmetic. And I would suggest you offer less than what either one is asking. Remember they do this for a living, so the dealers will take care of themselves...
Lastly, spend time with whatever TM you are looking at so you have a good feel for its condition and you get a sense of what you are paying for.
Good luck and hats off for your perseverance!
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Old 02-07-2014, 10:35 AM   #7
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Thanks so much everyone for the responses! It has been very helpful getting owner feedback on the prices and my other rambling thoughts. :P I didn't think I was completely out of line with my impressions.
I will be calling the insurance company today(why didn't I think of that?) and will let you know how it goes after our walk-through of the 2009 tomorrow.
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Old 02-08-2014, 09:42 PM   #8
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Well, the 2009 was a disappointment. The overall condition was okay. The hail damage was just cosmetic and the title was not salvage. But the previous owners installed an aftermarket rooftop AC. It was off-white and the bolts used around the opening were wonky. There was also way too much recaulking done in the interior so there were obviously some leak problems in the past. And it had a rear hitch receiver which is a no-no for us. We don't trust what another person loaded on the back and potentially did to the frame. The dealer offered to come down to $12K on it but we decided to pass. It was tempting to buy it and fix the issues but the risk of it was too much for us at that price point. *sigh*
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Old 02-12-2014, 08:35 PM   #9
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Gotta go with what u r comfortable with. I'm confident it will work out in time.
Keep us posted...
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Old 02-22-2014, 06:13 PM   #10
woodlandcottage
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Well, we bought the second TM. I don't know if I'm happy or annoyed or relieved or what. The unit had had only one owner, a retired couple and I do not exaggerate when I say it was like new inside and out. It had always been stored in the garage too. And it had some options I hadn't included in my previous NADA calculation.
Before we went to see it I pulled a bunch of listed 2619's from Craigslist and other sources with their NADA values to see what the average asking price was as compared to the values. 1.35% of NADA average seems to be the average asking price. They were asking 1.85% for this unit. Since all the other units are in other states, we also had to factor in our cost of lost work time and travel to buy elsewhere than close to home. Even with figuring in those extras over high retail NADA, the dealership turned down my highest offer. Luckily or unluckily my husband overrode me, went up again and they accepted.
But I did think of something that made me feel a little better. There is a huge underground market for TM's in the sense that most exceptional units are sold before they are even listed, like this one was with us. If all I have for value data is NADA and asking prices, it is a very small part of the picture. The demand out here is very high(Colorado Springs area). We've been shopping seriously for half a year and the ones prices under $15K usually go before I even get a chance to look at them. And who knows about the ones that never make it to the listing stage. And every unit we'd seen at other dealerships or from private sellers were listed at 1.1-1.5% of NADA and had a serious issue or two that would need correction. Which means $$. At least with this one we paid more but everything is pristine and ready to go.
I just wish the pricing and values of this stuff were more transparent so I could make sense of the math of it.
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