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Old 10-04-2011, 12:05 PM   #11
b&pcamping
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I too have to agree with the previous posts. It looks like TM may be trying to be all things to all people. We traded up to a used TM from a Coleman Santa Fe at almost twice the cost we paid for the Coleman. We felt the benefits of a TM outweighed the extra cost, and money well spent. That being said I don't think this new model's cost outweighs the benefit. In reading this forum I've seen many posts from folks just like us who use to own tent trailers; I wonder how many would have traded up to this version. Not us at that cost!! The engineering that is TM is what brought us to buy in the first place. Were else can you find a trailer with all it offers and yet closes to pull like our previous trailer. We were in Yosemite and Lake Tahoe last month and fielded lots of inquiries about our trailer. They are unique in every way, and a source of pride as an owner. TMs engineers should spend copious time reading this forum and fine tune those things that are of greatest concern to their owners and less time on looking at what other manufactures are making. Theyve got a great idea. Stick with it. I hope TM can come out of this intact, and able to grow their business with the tried and trued models that attracted us to buy a TM.
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Old 10-04-2011, 08:27 PM   #12
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I agree that TM should simplify their number of offerings. Do only what they do best, which is to make popup trailers...Elkmont was a disaster...
Yes, and I was surprised the Elkmont had the problems it did. I figured if anyone could make a superlight upright TM could. I am beginning to believe that TM should stick to their folding line and get the cost down.
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...Fix the toilet controversy by putting in a cartridge Thetford, which could easily be done, although it couldn't be emptied with the shell collapsed...
I believe it should be an option or at least do the venting options that seem to work.
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...There is a viable need for a trailer like the TM, and there is no competition...
I disagree but technically you are right.

Its what potential buyers think is a lightweight trailer. A folder may be more legitimate, but one that is fulltime upright is going to reach more potential buyers. Unless TM can get into price range ballpark they are going to have problems.

If they are going to expensive it make more business sense to make larger TMs not smaller ones. Personally I think any without the king bed ought to be avoided. That is if you are reaching out to either experience RV owners or newbies, you have to wonder how many are going to be happy crawling over their spouses in the night.
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Old 10-05-2011, 05:54 AM   #13
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One of the great selling points of the TM is that the small models will fit in a standard garage. That is why we bought it. I would not have considered one of the larger trailers but would have gone with an Aliner or similar instead if TM did not make a 24xx model.

Perhaps it is different now with the state of the economy, but I have always been amazed at the number of different models, styles, and manufacturers available in RVs generally. Considering the relatively small number of people who own campers, it always seemed to me that there were way too many different kinds. Walking through campgrounds you almost never see two of the same anything.
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Old 10-05-2011, 07:50 AM   #14
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Can you imagine if TrailManor sent a mailing or directed all owners of a TrailManor to a website and had us fill out a marketing questionnaire about our units? I usually hate these things but for TrailManor, Id be willing to spend an hour answering questions on what I like about the unit, what I hate about the unit, what key feature had me hooked for the sale, and so on.

Sure TM could look at these forum postings but a structured questionnaire would provide them with a huge, huge amount of important information on marketing direction and fine-tune the product lines.
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Old 10-05-2011, 09:23 AM   #15
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One of the great selling points of the TM is that the small models will fit in a standard garage...
I concur that the small trailer offering is of value. However, when a small, new TM is going for $25K and a 30' Palamino or a V Cross is going for the same you have a tougher sale.

Just going back a few years before I bought a TM, a $25K TM competing against a $15K ultralight trailer was tough to justify to this newbie. Looking at that again with more experienced RV eyes (and many happy years in a 3326) the $15K might win out. This would be especially true if I had not experience with a TM.

That is why I figure if you are willing to part with $25K for a TM, you likely have the storage space for a larger trailer. Further since an experienced RVer probably did not have to crawl over the spouse in the middle of the night, TMs with the king bed might be an easier sale to these types.

Really all the TMs need an easy way to get in and out of the bed. You know so you can just flop your feet down while toosh is on the bed...
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Old 10-05-2011, 12:09 PM   #16
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I agree that TM should simplify their number of offerings. Do only what they do best, which is to make popup trailers. The Elkmont was a disaster, especially for their reputation. Make a 26, maybe 2 27s, and one larger model. Fix the toilet controversy by putting in a cartridge Thetford, which could easily be done, although it couldn't be emptied with the shell collapsed. Big deal. There is a viable need for a trailer like the TM, and there is no competition. Just make them and don't diversify the product line. Just my opinion...
I agree Scott O.

Many years ago I had a long conversation with a friend who was a business consultant. His job was to go into a company, analyze its products, costs, and profits, and then recommend changes if necessary.

What he would do was to do a cost/profit analysis for each product the company made. If a line was a money loser, he recommended dropping it. In other words, make what earns profits, drop what loses money. One of the companies he analyzed was International Harvester, which adjusted its product lineup accordingly.

TM has been a small family owned company. I doubt seriously if they have thought this way in the past. How many MBA's do they have on their staff? My guess is none.

I suspect the Elkmont was the killer product. Not because it is a bad idea but with people bringing their trailers back for repair and outright demands for their money back, their reputation was hurt badly.

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Old 10-05-2011, 12:17 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by ng2951 View Post
I concur that the small trailer offering is of value. However, when a small, new TM is going for $25K and a 30' Palamino or a V Cross is going for the same you have a tougher sale.

Just going back a few years before I bought a TM, a $25K TM competing against a $15K ultralight trailer was tough to justify to this newbie. Looking at that again with more experienced RV eyes (and many happy years in a 3326) the $15K might win out. This would be especially true if I had not experience with a TM.

That is why I figure if you are willing to part with $25K for a TM, you likely have the storage space for a larger trailer. Further since an experienced RVer probably did not have to crawl over the spouse in the middle of the night, TMs with the king bed might be an easier sale to these types.

Really all the TMs need an easy way to get in and out of the bed. You know so you can just flop your feet down while toosh is on the bed...
I think that your thinking is quite valid, but many many folks do not think in this way. Their decision process deals more with two questions: 1. How much do I want this product. 2. How much are my payments.

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Old 10-05-2011, 02:02 PM   #18
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There has been some discussion here about the positive and negative aspects of the TM so I will share my opinion. For us the TM was perfect. It is a size we feel comfortable in and met DWs criteria of having a bathroom. Being able to store it in the garage out of the weather and sight of neighbors adds much value to it.

There are always a few down sides to everything. The two major problems seem to be smelly toilet and having to climb over someone to get out of the bed. I think the toilet is an easy fix. DW could smell the chemicals in the toilet so venting was needed. I put in the LIL Stanker fan but now think just running a vent from the toilet outside might have taken care of this issue. I have found even with the fan off I can detect odder coming from the venting. With the fan on low even in hot weather there has been no odder no matter what is in it. On low you cannot even hear the fan. I learned here there are a lot of things you can do to make the TM more livable and covenant so the only unresolved issue is the bed as we both sometimes have to get up in the night to use the odorless bathroom. We love our TM and I have recommended it to anyone that has asked, with a few words of caution about some of the drawbacks.

I do hope they can resolve whatever problems they are having and stay in business.
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Old 10-05-2011, 03:29 PM   #19
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I am with Lesherp as opinions go. Our 2619 is and has been the ideal trailer for us! Its our rolling bedrooms, kitchen and bathroom! We sleep in the same king sized bed at home but while camping we are happy in our own little domain! She in her spacious, well lighted, reading and television room and Me in my dark and cozy man cave! I do all the driving as we travel so I enjoy the solitude and quiet provided by the wardrobe and bathroom walls! We both are in our 60's so nightime bathroom use is a necessity! LOL!

Our toilet vents are a great mod and with a little bit of imagination and a few tool, anyone can do it! Mine is a straight shot through the wall and no electrical or small spaces to work in! All parts are basic and available locally!
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Old 10-05-2011, 05:23 PM   #20
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well I -for one- consider all this "crawling over" business a plus and a built in advantage of a TM.
since we only put liquids in the toilet I don't have a problem with the system.
some day I may change my mind, but that is where I am after two years of ownership.

I agree with the observations about the new model, but what I think really hurt TM was the loss of the inventor who had a good idea and vision and no one in a position to pick up the reins in a timely and orderly fashion.

Now what they need is good leadership and management to figure where they go from here.

And yes they could mine some seasoned ideas from this forum. Maybe they should sponsor a big rally at the plant and hold some focus group meeting....

Usually it is better to do less and do it well, than do try to do more and do it marginally.
I hope that TM gets back on an even keel and returns to producing good quality products of whatever size.
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