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  #1  
Old 09-01-2019, 04:15 PM
isotherm isotherm is offline
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Default Confused about specs through the years

As part of the search for a new (to me) Trailmanor, I have been reviewing (via archive.org) the specs that were posted each year on trailmanor.com. I have become extremely confused about the changes in the specs through the years.

Dry weights seem to increase through the years, without any obvious standard features being added. Also, as has been noted elsewhere on the forums, dry weight is much lower than sticker UVW... much more than the A/C and awning weights. The difference between UVW and dry weight seems to increase through the years, even though most features remain standard.

Here are some examples from my search:
  • 2015 TM 2417 (not Sport): 2150 (dry) vs. 2545 (UVW) = 395# more
  • 2006 TM 2619: 2673 (dry) vs. 2997 (UVW) = 324# more
  • 2002 TM 2720: 2555 (dry) vs. 2830 (UVW) = 275# more

Some selected changes between 2013 and 2015:
Code:
+-----------------+-------------------+-------------------+-------------+-------------+
|                 | 2417 Sport (2013) | 2417 Sport (2015) | 2417 (2013) | 2417 (2015) |
+-----------------+-------------------+-------------------+-------------+-------------+
| Dry weight      | 2150              | 2050              | 2280        | 2150        |
+-----------------+-------------------+-------------------+-------------+-------------+
| Width           | 7'1"              | 7'5"              | 7'7"        | 7'11"       |
+-----------------+-------------------+-------------------+-------------+-------------+
| Height (closed) | 5'7"              | 6'8"              | 5'7"        | 6'8"        |
+-----------------+-------------------+-------------------+-------------+-------------+
As far as the dry weight vs. UVW, I have gotten in the habit of just adding 300-400# to the dry weight in the spec. It is odd that the 2417's got lighter in a later model year.

What I'm really confused about is the change in width and height. It looks like the width increased 4" between 2013 and 2015 (across the board, not just 2417 models). Likewise, the height increased more than a foot between 2013 and 2015 (again, across the board).

Is anyone aware of what the changes are that yield all these changes? Or is it that older measurements are somehow less accurate? 7'11" + 2" for the awning would be too wide for my garage door... And 6'8" high starts adding the wind drag I was hoping to avoid. The shortest e.g. Casitas are only a foot taller than that.

If anyone actually has a 2015 (except Sport), I would be interested to know how wide and tall (closed) it actually is.

Last edited by isotherm; 09-01-2019 at 04:18 PM.
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  #2  
Old 09-01-2019, 09:14 PM
Larryjb Larryjb is online now
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Maybe I don't know how to search archive.com, but I couldn't get anything related to Trailmanor on archive.com. Do you have a link to it?
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  #3  
Old 09-01-2019, 09:35 PM
Larryjb Larryjb is online now
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I notice that the height and width specs change a lot in your data. The box and shells themselves have not changed that much, but roof AC options will increase height, awnings will increase width. It appears that your data is specific for 2417's with varying options. But, without seeing what you see from the archive.org, it's difficult for me to tell what you are looking at.
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Various TM images that you may or may not find elsewhere: http://www.trailmanorowners.com/forum/album.php?u=11700
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Old 09-02-2019, 06:40 AM
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For a bit of help, try this site

https://familyrvusa.com/dry-weight-g...t-does-it-mean

"Dry weight" refers to the trailer with no options or fluids. In other words, it is the lightest it is ever going to be.

"UVW is the weight of a vehicle as manufactured at the factory. It includes full engine and generator fuel tanks and fluids, if applicable. It does not include cargo, water, propane, or dealer-installed accessories." I assume that dealer installed accessories means options that were ordered by the customer, and are not installed on every trailer, but I might be wrong about this. Weight would certainly change from year to year as "options" become "standard items". For example, prior to about 2000, a spare tire was an option. I'm not sure about a battery and the airco, but I think the awning was once an option, and is now standard. Similar changes would cause apparent weight to change from year to year.

Similarly height and width would change as TM changed air conditioner models (from standard to low profile, for example), added a lift kit or higher-initial-rotation axles, or made the awning standard.

A Google search will turn up other helpful sites.

Bill
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Old 09-02-2019, 07:49 AM
isotherm isotherm is offline
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The dimension changes are across the board, not just 2417. Here are the same charts, from 2013 and 2015:
2013 Specifications
2015 Specifications
  • Inside heights are the same.
  • Widths are 4" wider.
  • Closed heights are 12.25" higher.
  • Open heights are 13.5" higher.

The 2015 page says this:
Quote:
Outside Height: Measurement includes optional low profile roof air and HDTV antenna (both approximately the same height). Subtract 6" if trailer is not equipped with these options. Outside Width: Add 2" if equipped with awning.
But that still leaves the closed heights 6.25"-7.5" higher, and the width 4" wider. With awning, it seems the width would be 8'3"...
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Old 09-02-2019, 08:53 AM
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Height- Lift kit became standard to run 15Ē wheels, later on they used a heavier duty axle that was clocked differently.

Width- Awning became standard equipment.

Weight- Do yourself a favor and just look at GVWR. I never pay attention to dry or unladen weights; I'll never tow the trailer at those weights. If my TV canít tpw the GVW then itís not a good fit.
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Old 09-02-2019, 10:15 AM
Larryjb Larryjb is online now
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If you look at the 2013 March capture, the notes at the bottom of the specifications state that you must add 6" if you choose the roof vent option, or 14 1/4" if you choose roof AC. This note was not captured for some reason in the September 2013 capture.

If you look at your March 2015 capture, the notes stat you must subtract 6" if you do not choose roof AC. Note that the subtract 6" is the difference between roof AC and a roof vent. If you did not have anything on the roof, you'd have to subtract about 12", which is pretty close to the "add 14 1/4"" for the 2013 specification.

The 2013 width specification states you must add 5" for the awning and clearance lights. The 2015 specification includes an awning and clearance lights. If the awning is not included, the 2015 specification states you just subtract 2". The reason you only subtract 2" is because you cannot remove clearance lights.

The difference in dry weight is only 100 lbs. This should be without any options, but what would TM consider as no options? I can't answer that. However, 100 lb difference is not significant. When you load it up with all your gear, add the battery (100 lbs right there), fill the propane (40 lbs), fill the fresh water tank (300 lbs), food, etc, you are looking at adding 1000 lbs easily. When towing, you should consider the GCWR of your tow vehicle. You may be under the limit for your trailer dry weight, but by the time you load the trailer, and put people in your TV for a trip, you could be over the limit. Four adults can add 600 lbs easily!

(So, 100 lb difference between 2013 and 2015 is not significant.)

I hope this helps.
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2002 Tahoe
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Various TM images that you may or may not find elsewhere: http://www.trailmanorowners.com/forum/album.php?u=11700
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Old 09-02-2019, 10:19 AM
Larryjb Larryjb is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shane826 View Post
Height- Lift kit became standard to run 15Ē wheels, later on they used a heavier duty axle that was clocked differently.

Width- Awning became standard equipment.

Weight- Do yourself a favor and just look at GVWR. I never pay attention to dry or unladen weights; I'll never tow the trailer at those weights. If my TV canít tpw the GVW then itís not a good fit.
I've always concerned myself with GCWR instead, but I know with a Tahoe it's unlikely I'd exceed the tongue weight in this measurement. If you have a unibody tow vehicle, the GCWR might be more important to consider. I did exceed the axle rating on one of my first trips when I didn't use a WDH. This could contribute to premature wheel bearing failure, or other mechanical failures related to the rear axle.
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Larry

2002 Tahoe
2008 4.6 Explorer
2001 2720SD

Various TM images that you may or may not find elsewhere: http://www.trailmanorowners.com/forum/album.php?u=11700
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  #9  
Old 09-03-2019, 07:20 AM
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One other thing. In the past, TM used a Winegard crank-up TV antenna, which laid down flat on the roof when cranked down. At some point, maybe around 2015, they changed over to the Jack antenna, which stands up taller, and does not collapse.

Bill
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  #10  
Old 09-03-2019, 12:47 PM
isotherm isotherm is offline
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Thank you! I think the dimension change makes more sense now:
  • The original heights didn't include the roof vent, even though it was standard.
  • The extra height is partially due to the larger tires and higher axle.
  • The extra height is partially due to including the A/C and TV antenna.
  • Only 6" is subtracted without A/C and TV antenna because there are still items (like the roof vent) on top.
And:
  • The original widths didn't include the awning or the running lights.
  • The new widths do include these, and removing the awning only saves 2" because the running lights are the other 2".
So the actual dimensions of identically configured models haven't changed appreciably, except maybe a bit due to the increased tire size and axle height. Any of the larger models should still (barely) fit through a garage door that is 8' wide.
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