Towing with a Toyota Sienna

Thanks for all the input to my original question. We just heard today that our new TM will arrive this weekend to be ready for delivery later next week. We are champing at the bit to get it home and begin the adventures.

Where do you go to get it weighed? I don't have a clue about where to try.

Just a comment about the weight of the items we plan to stow in the TM. I am going to weigh things individually that we would like to carry inside and record the weights on a spreadsheet. Once we have the true base weight, we can figure out the load by having it find the sum total. And once we get it rigged and on the road, we plan to leave the things in the TM pretty stable. One advantage to keeping our Sienna van is that we have lots of room inside it to carry things as well. And we have no desire for a generator, fire pit or even an outdoor grill larger than the portable one we already have.
Sara and Louie
2008 2720
2007 Toyota Sienna Van

Originally Posted by LittleRhodey

Where do you go to get it weighed? I don't have a clue about where to try.

Try your local rock quarry, feed mill, or truck stop. The truck stop will probably do it for a fee, and you might have to make a "donation" to the scale person at the other places. If you are using a WDH, make a couple of passes with different settings to tweak the setup. You can seperately weigh the TV front axle, both axles, and rear axle without the TM, and then with the TM you can weigh the TV front axle both axles, and the TM axle to determine how the WDH puts weight back on the front TV axle, what the tongue weight is, and the total weight of the TM. The figures are interesting.

Check my post (#3) in: http://www.trailmanorowners.com/foru...ead.php?t=7041

Chap

[Bill]

In my town in Maine we have a Landfill, and a Solid Waste Transfer Station (we used to call it the town dump). Almost everyone who comes in pays a fee based on the weight of what they dump - whether it's a pickup truck full of leaves that you raked off your lawn, or a 20-ton commercial garbage compactor truck. And that means they have a scale. If I show up on a slow day and chat up the scale jockey, he will let me weigh my rig in several configurations, and provide a CERTIFIED printout for each configuration, with no charge. Just gotta let him know how much I appreciate his help.

In addition to Chap's suggested configuration, you might also weigh just one TM wheel, so that you can check left-right balance. The 2720SL models, for example, have all the water tanks (fresh, gray, and black) on the left side. As a result, it is easy to overload the left wheel even when the total weight is within spec.

And I'm in agreement with Wayne. Rather than start by weighing an empty TM and then weighing everything you put in it, I might suggest loading up your TM as if you were going on a trip (food, water, clothing, dishes, microwave, propane, tools, etc etc etc) and then weighing anything you take out. It is too easy to miss things the other way, and you'll be a lot more confident of the number.

Bill

You can weigh at one of these locations for about 10 dollars or so:

http://www.catscale.com/

[CAmark]

"Knowledge is power" -- or at least comforting...
my experience at a CAT scale in CA was great...it was $8 for the initial weight and $1 each for re-weighs within 24 hrs. (Yes Wayne, about $10). Tweaking the WDH several ways, really understanding what is going on, and knowing, rather than guessing, what my margins are, is great "peace of mind" for me since I have a smaller TV.
The only "problem" was that the "push to talk" button at the scale was at big-rig window level and I needed a stick to reach it.
Mark

[ThePair]

Although this is an old thread, I'll put this information in for the next Sienna owner looking for answers:

Siennas up to and including 2007 have all the hardware in the engine needed for towing. Tranny cooler, oil, etc. It's all in there, default, no tow package needed, and I've verified this with Toyota Central. I have a 2006, no "tow package", so it was of concern to me. The tow package for these models adds the 1 1/2 inch receiver, and that's it.

2008+ models need the "tow package", which includes an oil cooler. Otherwise, these models are not fit for towing a TM.

Thanks!

Marc

I'm surprised that a 2008 Sienna would require another transmission cooler, since the automatics have one already. We use a 2006 Nissan Quest minivan to pull a 2720. I called Nissan USA and asked whether or not I should install an auxiliary transmission cooler, but they said that the tow package (rated ONLY to 3500) doesn't include a "second" cooler other than the same one all the models have.

And it pulls like it's not even there - we love it.

Jason

[ShrimpBurrito]

Originally Posted by jasongold

I'm surprised that a 2008 Sienna would require another transmission cooler, since the automatics have one already.

It's not that you need another cooler, it's just that it's best to run the tranny at as low of a temp as possible. All vehicles I've ever heard of with automatic transmissions have transmission coolers. Adding a second one just adds cooling capacity. One big one is roughly the same as 2 smaller ones that together are about the same size as the big one.

Dave

[ThePair]

Plus, for the 2008+ Sienna, I don't think it's a tranny cooler that's the issue, I think it's the oil cooler that's missing, IIRC.

I can check if anyone is really interested or needs the info.

Marc

This link has great information. But I just (last week) bought my used 3124KB from CampingLand in Bakersfield. Paid $17K for a 2007. We choose to buy a larger unit with King bed to fit my wife, 5 kids, 2 cats, and myself. We got back yesterday towing the 3124KB from Bakersfield to Denver, via Las Vegas --> Flagstaff --> Albuquerque --> Pueblo --> Colorado Springs --> Denver. The maximum altitude was 7600 feet on the I40 at Flag Staff, and 7200 at the southern I25 entry into Colorado. I pretty much maintained the 73 MPH speeds along the I40 (limit is 75 MPH) and kept the speed down to 65 MPH (limit 75 MPH) along the I25 in Colorado due to high sheer winds.

I now own a 2004 Sienna XLE with a towing package. I understand that means a bigger radiator and water pump as verbally told to me by the Toyota dealer. But no transmission cooler!

To prepare for the trip I was told by TM customer service to put on the Toyota Sienna a Class 3 WDH (Weight Distribution Hitch) with I believe a 20 inch ball height. So I had the hitch installed locally in Denver before I left for the quick “high country route” to Bakersfield along the I70 (over the Rockies and thru the Eisenhower tunnel at 11,200 feet) and then down the I15 to Barstow --> then local roads to Bakersfield, CA. My plan was to not return on my maiden voyage over the Rockies since I did not know Number 1) if I could get the propane tanks back thru the Eisenhower Tunnel, and Number 2) If I could climb up to 11,200 feet and “make the grade”. Keep in mind that all you previous comments to this thread take the sissy hills of the east coast, and no one spoke about pulling a 3124KB with Sienna over the 11,000 foot elevation mark. Keeping in mind that I felt 100% certain that I would be forced to install chains to climb back home over the 13,200 foot elevation of Loveland pass. So I believe I choose wisely to take the southern route home!!!

I told the hitch installer I wanted the “best” hitch he could install. They in stalled a Valley WDH, with a Prodigy Brake Controller. The ball adapter thingy that installs into the 2” class III hitch weighs like 50 pounds. The hitch installer told me to start working out in the gym. I struggle and by leveraging the hitch adapter thingy on the ground have managed to install the piece without too much trouble. Then they tossed into my trunk area two mighty big and heavy WDH leveling arms/springs/bars, or whatever you call them components, chains, and clamps, and I was off to hit the road to AAMCO to have them install the Transmission cooler. AAMCO managed to install the cooler in about 3 hours allowing for cooling time of the engine before they started the work. They were able to complete the task without removing the Sienna Bumper. They recommended that I give it a week to settle in to make sure there were not any transmission coolant leaks. But I left on the trip the very next morning.

In the process of installing the new Class III hitch they removed my old class 1 hitch so the overall loss of clearance on my Toyota from hitch to pavement was about 1 more inch since the Class III hitch is somewhat larger then the class 1 hitch.

We choose to leave Denver at 8 AM arriving in Bakersfield, CA 20 hours later at 2AM the next morning, and only making two 1 hour stops, and 3 gas stops (two combined with the 1 hour eating stops) and going about 350 miles between gas fill ups without pulling any trailer. Then we spent the night at a motel in Bakersfield to get well rested for the start of our big adventure the next day.

We arrived at the Bakersfield CampingWorld trailer sales site at about NOON, and began our six hour ordeal in getting what was thought to be a simple hitch up and on the road again. All the paperwork was done ahead of time. The issue was that CampingWorld never hooked up “such a big trailer” to a minivan. Well after three technicians and a few hours they finally adjusted the WDH to work properly. Yes at first the empty clearance between the bottom of the hitch to the pavement was 4 inches. After hookup and before WDH adjustments and leveling arms installed, we had about 1.5 inch clearance. But finally after the installation was set correctly (5th chain link out of 9 link choices on both WDH leveling arms) the hitch was perhaps 5 or 6 inches off the ground. Being a Mechanical Engineer, I was amazed how it all worked. My Sienna actually was leveraged to ride nicer with trailer then without. Awesome!

We took the route home as described but first staying 3 nights at the Las Vegas Oasis RV resort. Now now folks nobody has forewarned me how insignificant I would fell camped next to those huge $100K+ motor homes. It became a joke for us. My 6 year old also said… “Dad, the TM is nice, but I think we soon will need to upgrade to a larger motor home like”, and he points to the huge monster in the next camp site. Not only was it 20 feet longer then my deployed TM, but perhaps twice as tall, and four pop-out sections. WOW.

Now for my impression on how my Sienna pulled the 3124KB TM on this journey home. Normally my Sienna rides at around 1700 RPM, with perhaps 2500 RPM on the steep hills around Colorado. With the TM attached it was significantly noticeable that I had a lot more drag. Normal straight away level travel my engine kept around 3000 RPM at 65 MPH. On the hills it notched up to about 4000 RPM. And on the very very steep hills about 4500 RPM (the Sienna RPM redline starts at 7000 RPM). I kept the transmission set to gear "4" and NOT D which I was told means overdrive and would overheat the transmission. The temperatures during the journey home was about 75 degrees F. I did experiment keeping the RPMs below 3000 RPM on the steep hills but quickly found myself moving over into the trucker lanes and having to accept a speed of perhaps 40 – 45 MPH. After a while that got old with my self imposed deadline to be home before dark to drop off the TM at the storage park in the light. I made my pre-dusk goal by 30 minutes! One comment was the huge steep grade from Baker CA up to I15 towards the CA/Nevada state line. I maintained about 55 MPG (Ca towing speed limit) and did just fine in the trucking lane, but occasionally had to move into the middle lane to pass trucks.

One more comment, I found myself filling up the Sienna with full tanks of gas (above 16 gallons) ever 240 miles (verses the non-towing 350 miles per tank). I figure that my TM dropped my Sienna's mileage from 18 MPG (non-towing) down to 12 to 14 MPG (towing at 65 - 73 MPH).

We plan not to take the mountainous routes during this summer's vacations, but rather check out the level areas and ranches in Kansas. I much rather be kinder to the Sienna. Our longer term plans over the next few years is to eventually purchase a Toyota Sequoia. But for now the Sienna seems capable to perform up to my expectations. Keep in mind again, I pulled 7 in the car, and a lot of junk too, and a 3124TM with EMPTY water tanks. We will see how a full 40 gallon fresh H2O tank affects our ride on our next journey on the road once all the Denver snows are gone for the season.

But in summary, I do believe to keep up to full highway speed the Sienna is marginal, but a good economic choice verses buying another gas guzzeling vehicle now, verses after the next large increase in gas prices (hopefully they will then be giving away Sequoias when gas returns to $5/gallon).

Barry