Specific Recommendations for Improving TM

[quote author=shunter917 link=board=22;threadid=1993;start=msg14074#msg1407 4 date=1086568614]

The comment about the awning I don't get. You do realize that after you extend the awning and adjust the "legs", you then reel the awning back in a little until it is tight, yes?

[/quote]

I meant the Window Awning. The Fiamma Awning works fine. TM and the dealer were well aware of the window awning screws not tightening properly on some of their units. This should also not be extended all the way out. The dealer also warned me not to tighten the latch for the shell since the screws could pop out (the 4 that you clamp on during the last part of closing the shell). Make sure this is not too tight. There are a lot of these little things like this that are not explained in the manual, which is why I recommend they update their manual (hopefully they get very innovative).

Ed of TM and the dealer suspect my TM was "rushed" for the RV show. I suspect that they had a lot of new workers because of the high volume they experienced.

http://oakridger.com/stories/010604/...40106034.shtml

TM is a small manufacturer and I suspect that there were some short cuts taken to meet the heavy volume. I agree with the assessment of one poster and feel that something is missing in their quality control/assurance to allow something like my TM to be shipped. I did not go ever every nook and cranny of the TM during checkout. I had a lot of faith that the quality would be superb. I am sure that it was an major challenge for them to meet the heavy volume and hopefully they learn from the experience. However, I will be much less trusting next time when buying an RV. I did check out the Jayco website showing their QC on a video (maybe TM needs something like this). Maybe mine was built on a Monday by an individual or two who were hung over?

I recommend everyone to use EdFelkers List for checking out the RV prior to taking it home. I was not aware of this site until after delivery.l In retrospect, I would have done it on a weekday when there is less customer traffic as well. Don't rush!

I think the guts of the TM is great. I would recommend greater attention to details on every little details to get to the next level.

[jbeletti]

I have problems with my table leg locking mechanism nearly every time I use it. I end up fixing it with leatherman tool I keep in the trailer. I reported this and a few other items to my dealer and will have him look at it next time I get up his way.

Jim

http://www.beletti.com/travel

[Bill]

What kind of table-leg trouble are you folks having? On my first time out, I pulled the leg out too far, and sure enough, it was a little bit of a pain to get back in. Since then, I haven't pulled it out too far.

Sounds like you are having a different problem ...

Bill

[jbeletti]

Hi Bill,

Inside my table leg, there is a 2 part locking mechanism. It's this 2 part mechanism that gives me trouble. When I extend the leg, the mechanism sometimes falls apart. It's just not held captive in the leg well. Maybe I'm missing a spring or something?

Jim

[Bill]

Yeah, I remember that two-part mechanism. Seems to me there were a couple different ways it could go together - with differing results.

Unfortunately, I just put my TM in a storage lot across town. Although we have no HOA, we have a snippy lady next door who has nothing to do but complain to all the neighbors about "that awful trailer" - even though it was tucked into a corner and only half visible from the street.

I hope to have it out for a trip within a month. I'll try to remember to check it out then, and post back.

Bill

[quote author=jbeletti link=board=22;threadid=1993;start=msg14078#msg1407 8 date=1086574520]
I have problems with my table leg locking mechanism nearly every time I use it. I end up fixing it with leatherman tool I keep in the trailer. I reported this and a few other items to my dealer and will have him look at it next time I get up his way.

Jim

http://www.beletti.com/travel
[/quote]

Mine was fixed, but it falls apart too easily. It fell apart when the dealer showed me how to use it correctly. Even when in the proper position, it is an accident awaiting to happen. I have 2 youngsters and I would hate for them to intentionally or accidentally knock push the short exposed end and knock the whole table out of place. I have several potential modification for this.

I have a lot of extra Allen wrenches from the one large one I needed for the leveling jacks. I could just insert it into the hole and put some duct tape around the long end. That would be more secure. I'm going to the hardware store tonight and look for a nut and screw that has a handle.

We went to pick up our new 2720 on Friday (unfortunately due to incorrect wiring we had to postpone pickup). We did our walk through that day and the dealer had the same problem with the leg on the table. It fell apart on him as he was demonstrating how to set it up and take it down. He admitted he thought it was a very poor design. We also will be camping with 2 small children. I would be very interested in knowing of any tricks people use to make this work easier and be safer.

CCC:

Sorry you had so many irritants to correct. We haven't bought yet, but we've looked at a lot of campers and I have an opinion that says QC are two letters missing from most RV manufacturers lexicon. We even looked at Airstream and I was shocked at the quality of this $52K camper and how much their workmanship has erroded since the early 1990s. We looked at a Rialta (that's a VW commercial truck chasis with a motor home body built by Winnebago -- a mere $64K -- shoddy workmanship and really cheal lookinh veneered press board throughout. When I opened the kitchen cabinets they hadn't even vacuumed out all the saw dust from cutting.

I suspect that even with the problems you had, TM is still fairly high up on the list in terms of quality because they are not producing huge volumes and they can use teams to build slow, rather than quickly to meet the numbers quotas. I'm sure the description you gave of the show requirements is exactly what caused what happened to your TM. I've looked at lots of new TMs, and I've noticed some minor things but nothing that really sent up a red flag to say that their overall quality was pretty bad.

As important as initial quality is, I think what and how your dealers handles those problems is far more important -- and clearly one of the things that sets TM aparts. I've read a few threads here about bad dealer relationships, but I think by and large the TM dealers are proud of what they sell and will go out of their way to help. The problem is that usually we live several hours from the nearest dealer so we just suck it up and do the repaire as best we can.

I tried to hit most everything I could think of in the acceptance checklist I compiled. You've given me some additional things to add to the checklist.

Couldn't agree more with your opinion of the owners manual. Bob Strong, or Hal (forget who) sent me the electrons of the owners manual. Being a good AF maintenance officer, I wanted to ensure that I understood the "tech order" inside and out before I bought a rig and commenced my "on-the-job" training. My first impression was that it's a scanned version of a blue mimeographed guide. One of my projects (after we buy) is to write the "Ed Felker Improved Owners Manual." It will contain concise step by step instructions. It will contain digital photos to show the steps that are being described. It will be the "idiot's guide" to operating a TM. I have a son and two daughters (grown, married, and with kids of their own). They'll be borrowing both the TV & the TM -- and the guide I write will be for my mechanically challenged, "how does tab A fit in slot B", why can't a wrench be used as a hammer son-in-law. Once written, I'll share it with anyone else who might want it. I'll even offer it to the factory if they want to give it out.

And finally, I think one of the truly great things about a TM is what you see right here -- friendly people who go out of their way to answer other owner's questions and offer tips. I was sort of sold on the TM design. I sure wanted something easy to tow -- but it's the folks on this website that really sold me on the TM. I know if I have a question or problem -- someone on these pages is going to go out into their yard, sweep the two feet of snow off their winter stowed TM, pop that puppy open, just so that they can come back and tell me what they think the answer is. That's not exactly related to the factory quality that started all this -- but clearly the personal quality of the owners and their sense of TM community is an intangible quality factor you won't find many other places.

I hope you get all your issues rectified so that when you are listening to the crickets chirp (or the cicadas), under a perfect star filled sky, with those you love most -- the main thing on your mind won't be, "Hmmm, wonder why that inverter is making that noise?"

Good luck.

Ed

I agree with Ed. I also have not yet acquired my TM, but have used this site for references and have been pleased to find it quite helpful.

The TM "family" may not be as large as some of the other clubs, but it seems close knit and friendly with members always willing to help.

I may never get my TM, due to living north of the border wher they are not sold, and to the limitations of my current TV ( limitations discovered on this site), but I enjoy checking in daily to see what information I can pick up.

John

[quote author=efelker link=board=22;threadid=1993;start=msg14177#msg1417 7 date=1086916415]
CCC:

Sorry you had so many irritants to correct. We haven't bought yet, but we've looked at a lot of campers and I have an opinion that says QC are two letters missing from most RV manufacturers lexicon. We even looked at Airstream and I was shocked at the quality of this $52K camper and how much their workmanship has erroded since the early 1990s. We looked at a Rialta (that's a VW commercial truck chasis with a motor home body built by Winnebago -- a mere $64K -- shoddy workmanship and really cheal lookinh veneered press board throughout. When I opened the kitchen cabinets they hadn't even vacuumed out all the saw dust from cutting.

I suspect that even with the problems you had, TM is still fairly high up on the list in terms of quality because they are not producing huge volumes and they can use teams to build slow, rather than quickly to meet the numbers quotas. I'm sure the description you gave of the show requirements is exactly what caused what happened to your TM. I've looked at lots of new TMs, and I've noticed some minor things but nothing that really sent up a red flag to say that their overall quality was pretty bad.

As important as initial quality is, I think what and how your dealers handles those problems is far more important -- and clearly one of the things that sets TM aparts. I've read a few threads here about bad dealer relationships, but I think by and large the TM dealers are proud of what they sell and will go out of their way to help. The problem is that usually we live several hours from the nearest dealer so we just suck it up and do the repaire as best we can.

I tried to hit most everything I could think of in the acceptance checklist I compiled. You've given me some additional things to add to the checklist.

Couldn't agree more with your opinion of the owners manual. Bob Strong, or Hal (forget who) sent me the electrons of the owners manual. Being a good AF maintenance officer, I wanted to ensure that I understood the "tech order" inside and out before I bought a rig and commenced my "on-the-job" training. My first impression was that it's a scanned version of a blue mimeographed guide. One of my projects (after we buy) is to write the "Ed Felker Improved Owners Manual." It will contain concise step by step instructions. It will contain digital photos to show the steps that are being described. It will be the "idiot's guide" to operating a TM. I have a son and two daughters (grown, married, and with kids of their own). They'll be borrowing both the TV & the TM -- and the guide I write will be for my mechanically challenged, "how does tab A fit in slot B", why can't a wrench be used as a hammer son-in-law. Once written, I'll share it with anyone else who might want it. I'll even offer it to the factory if they want to give it out.

And finally, I think one of the truly great things about a TM is what you see right here -- friendly people who go out of their way to answer other owner's questions and offer tips. I was sort of sold on the TM design. I sure wanted something easy to tow -- but it's the folks on this website that really sold me on the TM. I know if I have a question or problem -- someone on these pages is going to go out into their yard, sweep the two feet of snow off their winter stowed TM, pop that puppy open, just so that they can come back and tell me what they think the answer is. That's not exactly related to the factory quality that started all this -- but clearly the personal quality of the owners and their sense of TM community is an intangible quality factor you won't find many other places.

I hope you get all your issues rectified so that when you are listening to the crickets chirp (or the cicadas), under a perfect star filled sky, with those you love most -- the main thing on your mind won't be, "Hmmm, wonder why that inverter is making that noise?"

Good luck.

Ed
[/quote]

Ed, this is an extremely thoughtful post. Again, I believe the initial quality of my TM was an abberation. I love the engineering of the TM and the American story that it is. I am part of the TM community now and only hope to see it get better and better and attract more and more customers. I think TM has the potential to be an Amerian icon like Airstream. She is a beauty and attracts so much attention on the road and in the camp. Attention to details in every aspect of their product could get them there and I would love to see them there.

I like my TM a lot despite some of the problems I've had. I'm sure I could have avoided many of these problems if I had known about this site before purchase. Part of it was learning curve and this site has been extremely helpful. Dealer and TM customer service have been good.

I have a copy of your step by step and they are extremely helpful. It takes time and energy to come up with a simple and concise manual with digital pictures and all. I would love to see you work for TM on this endeavor.