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Old 01-16-2010, 12:01 PM   #11
M&M Hokie
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Thanks for all of the information. I was certainly thinking about future places in the Sierra Nevadas. Currently the Sienna has been fine because we have basically been taking 2-hour trips over relatively flat coastal terrain. However, we are right up against the Los Padres National Forest and there are a some steep options to explore in there, pave and unpaved, with and without the TM. I am not looking to do serious offroading but I foresee crossing stream beds, spots with loose gravel, etc. We also have friends who camp on Pismo with their ATVs and it would be fun to join them. I don't see serious need for 4x4 capability all of the time but there are enough scenarios in the above description for which 4x4 would be welcome. As for the weight impacts assumed by a 4x4 I am not too concerned with that because the gear I am looking to carry is not the really heavy stuff like ATVs and motorcycles. I am probably only needing to carry about 500 lbs of cargo in the truck bed plus the 4K TM.

The Sienna has been kind of a pain because of weight and cargo limitations. We ultimately would like to bring 2 adult mountain bikes, 2 kid bikes, a trailer to tow the kids on the bikes, cooler, genset, etc. It is a pain to fit all of that gear in the back of the van and you can't realistically do that and stay within the weight ratings. So I have been having to pick and choose what gear to bring, weighing a lot of stuff, etc. Plus I have to tow the TM without water. I would like more flexibility there.

I am not concerned about gas mileage at all. 10MPG or 20MPG isn't going to matter in a vehicle that will probably not be driven more than 4-5K per year. My commuter vehicle is my Corolla and my wife drives the van for all of her duties around town. We do not lead high mileage lifestyles. My commute is 40 miles round trip each day but the wife only drives the van about 5K miles per year. Other than trips with the TM, miles on the truck would be just reducing miles on the van. The bottom line is that mileage isn't a driver.

I am not considering the Tacoma because it is not heavy duty enough. It is a shame because I think the Tacoma is the best looking truck out there. The Tundra for example is really ugly to my eye when compared to the Tacoma.

I do appreciate all the different perspectives. They are helping me cogitate on the options.
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Old 01-16-2010, 03:27 PM   #12
ragmopp
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Quote:
I am not considering the Tacoma because it is not heavy duty enough.

I do not understand what you mean by 'not heavy duty enough'. I pull our trailer with one up and down the Sierras (I am already at 5000 feet where I live) and haven't had to downshift to more than 4th gear, it is a 6 spd. Properly equipped it has a 6500 tow rating and with the stuff you are thinking of carrying I would think it would be more than adequate.

Mike Anderson
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Old 01-16-2010, 03:42 PM   #13
Jim&Joan
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Default Just a few observations in my personal experience...

I am on my second F150. One is 15 y/o, the second is 3.5 y/o. Both with 2WD and shells. The older one has had several sets of filters and tires, a few sets of shocks, brakes. Shop repairs - one warranty power mirror and lower ball joints. Older daughter took it over and then handed it to younger who is driving it now. The newer one - filters and oil.

I bike ride, camp, hunt, fish, dive out of mine. Go tent camping with DW and 2 daughters for a week and include 3 sets of dive gear with tanks to get an idea of how much a truck with a shell can hold Go tech diving with a buddy for a week. Tech gear to include 14 tanks. Travel to various cities with buddy to do triathlons. (Two or three expensive bikes under cover.)

In the last 15 years, I have wished I had 4x4 about a half dozen times. Once I parked 40 yards further from a cave dive site to avoid getting stuck, so had to carry gear further. Once I almost got stuck getting out of a dive site where the snow and ice got warmed up by mid-day sun. The other times it just seemed convenient, but I got by without it. I considered 4x4 for both vehicle purchases, but in addition to the points already listed, two other factors played in my decision. 4x4 is more difficult to get in an out of, especially for DW and kids. When kids were smaller, I test drove one and the youngest almost face-planted getting out. DW said, "In a pig's eye." Other factor is that an unloaded 4x4 can be a harsh ride. Admittedly, my trucks are 'toy boxes' and I like leather, heated seats, power accessories and a comfortable ride.

My current Ford, I get ~17mpg typical, ~19mpg good case. I haven't towed TM enough yet to have deltas. I will say pulling TM is not a problem. I love having a shell to secure and protect cargo. Current shell is very secure (as a shell can be). You'd have to break the rear glass to get in, like an SUV and the lock is integrated with the power door locks. I have owned an S10 with a shell and rear hatch that you could jerk open when locked. I also had a Suburban and I don't like my cargo in my passenger area. Wet or damp camping and dive gear is not pleasant on a long drive and not as easy to hose out as truck.
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Old 01-16-2010, 04:15 PM   #14
M&M Hokie
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Originally Posted by ragmopp View Post
IProperly equipped it has a 6500 tow rating
I guess I misread the info on the Toyota website. I thought I read that it was in 3500-4000 ballpark. If it is 6500, I would certainly reconsider. Thanks for data. I certainly am not looking to max out the capacity of my tow vehicle but if the Tacoma is that capable, I will take a second look.

To be honest, the smaller the truck the better as long as there is enough extra capability so that I am not overstressing it. I have a full garage as it is with the TM in there.
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Old 01-16-2010, 10:03 PM   #15
MudDog
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The current model Toyota tow guide/ratings can be found here (starting on page 5):

http://www.toyota.com/pdfs/towguide_Part3.pdf

The Tacoma ranges from 3500 to 6500 depending on the model and whether or not you have the factory tow package.
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Former:
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Old 01-16-2010, 11:01 PM   #16
M&M Hokie
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Originally Posted by MudDog View Post
The current model Toyota tow guide/ratings can be found here (starting on page 5):

http://www.toyota.com/pdfs/towguide_Part3.pdf

The Tacoma ranges from 3500 to 6500 depending on the model and whether or not you have the factory tow package.
MudDog, I reviewed the info you link to earlier today and after doing the math on loading, a Tacoma's rating exceeds my needs. I am curious, it looks like the Tacoma tow package has the 7-wire harnessing but it does not have a built-in brake controller. Was it easy to mount your Prodigy and use the existing wiring?
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Old 01-17-2010, 12:28 AM   #17
MudDog
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CustomRV had installed the Prodigy on my Sienna (the Sienna was not pre-wired so they had to run the connections to the battery, 7 pin on the rear and tie into the brake light line). I removed it from the Sienna before I traded it in.

The Tacoma came with a harness plug under the dash with all of the connections already wired. It was a bit of a challenge to find the connector. It was wrapped to a larger bundle and I didn't know exactly where to look. Got some good info from tacomaworld.com and found it more by feel than sight because it was tucked behind the bundle and was facing the body of the truck rather than the interior.

In a plastic bag left in the glove box Toyota includes the other end of the connector with 4 loose wires.

You can either order a Prodigy Harness for the Tacoma and plug right into the connector under the dash (and not use the generic connector Toyota provides), or you can use the generic harness and match the wires yourself. Toyota includes a diagram of their side of the connector. After a bit of digging online I found the Prodigy side diagram and then just joined the wires.

Then it was just a matter of finding a place to mount it where it would be in the proper orientation. I found a spot near the fuse cover on the drivers left side that worked out well. A couple of screws later, I was done.

If you can join 4 wires, tap two screws and rest your head on the floormat while you search for the plug, it shouldn't be a problem
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Former:
2009 2619 w/swing tongue
TV 2010 Tacoma Dbl Cab PreRunner
Prodigy Brake Controller/TST TPMS
15" Maxxis M8008 225/75R15
Honda EU2000i (Tri-Fuel Converted)
160W Solar/Morningstar Sunsaver MPPT
Xantrex Link-Lite & ProWatt SW2000 Inverter

Current:
2016 KZ Vision 23BHS
2015 Ford F150 SuperCrew 3.5 EcoBoost
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Old 01-17-2010, 06:26 AM   #18
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I'm in the same boat as M&M, thought I wanted a '05/'06 Tundra because they're a bit smaller, but found out the tow limit is 6500 and gas mileage terrible. Started looking at bigger ones and like the new Fords. I need 4X4. Anyone here tow with a 4X4 F150? What is the gas mileage?

The newer Tacoma would work, but I'm concerned about the lower HP for towing here in the mountains with a ATV in the bed and a TM on the hitch!
I'm using a 2007 F-150 4x4 crew cab with the big Triton V8 to tow my 2720SL. Mileage locally (not a lot of stop and go) without the TM is 15-17, depending, and up to 19 mpg on the Interstate with little wind while in Colorado. At lower altitudes (trip to Vermont, for example), I'll tend to lose a couple of mpg -- perhaps due to the additional air density causing more drag. Keep in mind that we always travel with quite a bit of stuff in the truck, both in the back seat and in the bed (we have a shell, too).

With the TM attached I get from 11 (uphill, steep Rocky Mountain grades, or 35-50 mph headwind) to 17 (rare -- 62 mph on I-25 with a tailwind). Overall with the TM it runs around 13.3-15.5 mpg.
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Old 01-17-2010, 08:16 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by Redhawk View Post
I'm in the same boat as M&M, thought I wanted a '05/'06 Tundra because they're a bit smaller, but found out the tow limit is 6500 and gas mileage terrible. Started looking at bigger ones and like the new Fords. I need 4X4. Anyone here tow with a 4X4 F150? What is the gas mileage?
Redhawk, my mileage is very similar to Larry N's. I have a 2006 F150 4x4, 5.4L engine (330 cu. in. Triton), 3.73 gears, Super Cab, 6.5' bed with a tonneau cover. Messing around the area running errands and stuff, I get 16.5 to 17.5 mpg. Interstate driving without a trailer I get 20+ mpg @ 65 mph. Back roads with few stops lights in the rolling hills around here....again right around 20 to 21 mpg. Flat land back roads with few stop lites then I get 21 to 22 mpg.

Towing with my 2720, I got anywhere between 14.5 to 16.3 mpg. Figure in back roads in the mountains with plenty of manuevering, those figures went south.

Now towing a conventional travel trailer weighing in at 5500 lbs. ready to camp, my mileage is now around 11 mpg on the interstate, and 11.5 to 12 on the back roads with a few stops and starts.

I do consider myself a very conservative driver, with gas mileage as a priority over speed and jack rabbit starts.
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Old 01-17-2010, 09:14 AM   #20
ragmopp
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Regarding installing a Prodigy in the Tacoma....As I usually have to spend time figuring out which end of a screwdriver to use, I had it installed. They used the wiring in the Tacoma and what came in the box. I expected it to take at least an hour or maybe two for them to install it so I brought a book along to read while waiting. It ended up taking them less than a half hour and $41....So that is an alternative if you don't want to get your hands dirty...

Mike Anderson
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