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Old 04-11-2005, 07:26 PM   #1
grampa
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Default Towing with 4 cylinder compact pickups

We have a 1998 toyota tacoma, 4 cyl., 5 spd. Tow rating is 3500lbs gtw. and 350 lbs. tongue weight. Has anyone towed a 2619/2720, or equivalent older TM with a similar vehicle? What was your over all experience? Thanks. Grampa
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Old 04-13-2005, 06:55 AM   #2
RockyMtnRay
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Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
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Default A very, very, very iffy proposition

Quote:
Originally Posted by grampa
We have a 1998 toyota tacoma, 4 cyl., 5 spd. Tow rating is 3500lbs gtw. and 350 lbs. tongue weight. Has anyone towed a 2619/2720, or equivalent older TM with a similar vehicle? What was your over all experience? Thanks. Grampa
That this is the first response your question has gotten in about 2 days should tell you that few (if any) other people have tried to use any 4 cylinder pickup to tow a TM (typically new questions elicit some response within a couple of hours, not days). I sorta, kinda recall that someone in Kentucky (or thereabouts) reported a couple of years ago that they'd tried using a 4-cylinder Ford Ranger...a pickup roughly comparable to your Taco. As I recall they quickly discovered the lack of power (down to 25 mph on almost any hill, even at near sea level) was a huge problem...so it wasn't long at all before they traded their truck in for a V8 powered Ford Explorer.

As the defacto Towing Moderator here (and the Towing Moderator at TundraSolutions.com (largest Toyota owners group on the internet with a very large and active Tacoma community), I'll take a stab at answering your questions. You will note from my signature (below) that I tow a TM2720SL with a fairly modified ("souped up") Toyota Tundra. The reason I made a lot of those modifications was to get more towing torque as even the stock Tundra with a 4.7L V8 (and 319 ft-lbs of torque) was just barely adequate for repeated mountain towing. Before I got the Tundra, I tried towing my TM with a 100 inch wheelbase Jeep Cherokee that was equipped with a 4.0L I-6 engine that put out 220 ft-lbs of torque. The primary reason I traded the Jeep for the Tundra was the Jeep engine simply didn't have enough power for mountain towing; additionally the short wheelbase was a bit marginal for controlling a 20 foot trailer on mountain roads.

You didn't mention exactly which engine your truck has (2.4L or 2.7L...this makes some difference), where you'll be towing (low altitude flatlands or high altitude mountains...this makes a huge difference), and whether or not it's a regular cab (~103 inch wheelbase) or Xtra cab (~121 inch wheelbase)...the wheelbase makes some difference. So I'm going to take a stab at all these factors (plus the so-called towing rating and tongue weight issues).

First, the tow rating. Published tow ratings are a calculated number that is derived by subtracting the weight of an empty truck (driver only, no gas, no options, no cargo, no passengers) from the vehicle's Gross Combined Weight Rating (GCWR). It's a largely fictitious number because no-one ever actually tows with this type of truck...they always have cargo, people, gas, options etc. that add anywhere from 500 to 1000 lbs to the truck's empty weight. So, right from the start, your real tow rating is more like 2500 to 3000 lbs. The RV makers do a similar trick...they advertise the weight of an empty, no options trailer. Even the spare tire is considered an option and is not part of the advertised weight. By the time you add in typical options (especially heavy ones like air conditioning and awnings), load your stuff, food, propane, water, etc, the real weight of trailer is typically 500 to 700 lbs more than the advertised weight. An empty, no options 2619/2720 weighs around 2700 lbs and would have a go-camping weight of around 3000 lbs. At best (lightly loaded truck with only 2 people), that's just barely within your truck's capability at sea level...add some more cargo or people to the truck and you'd be overloaded. However, you'll find that nearly all used TMs have AC and most have other goodies like awnings, spare tires, etc. and thus the typical weight of a 2619 is around 3300 lbs when loaded for camping. You'd be substantially overweight with such a trailer.

Tongue weight. TMs have fairly high tongue weights for their total weight...typically 350 to as much as 750 lbs. My 2720SL has a tongue weight of about 600 lbs, one member with a lightly loaded and no options (not even AC or awning) 2619 has reported a 350 lb (or thereabouts) tongue weight. Generally people use weight distributing hitches (WDH) to handle higher tongue weights; however, I've read several Tacoma towing posts at TundraSolutions that reported that (1) Toyota strongly discourages the use of WDH on pre-'05 Tacomas and (2) there are many stories of broken frames arising from the use of a WDH on a Tacoma of your truck's vintage. Bottom line is only the lightest (i.e. no goodies like AC or awning) and most lightly loaded TM2619 (little food, no water at all in the onboard tanks) will have a low enough tongue weight for your truck.

Wheelbase. If you've got the Xtra cab model, you've got enough control for all towing conditions. If you've got the regular cab, the short wheelbase is a bit iffy for mountain towing.

Engine. The 2.4L has 158 ft-lbs of torque, the 2.7L has 177 ft-lbs (forget horsepower...it's a useless number for towing). As a general rule, I discourage anyone from trying to tow a TM with an engine that has less than 200 ft-lbs (even at sea level)...you'll be so slow on hills that you'll be both incredibly frustrated and a hazard to traffic. And in high altitude mountain conditions, you'll be in 1st gear at 15 mph for miles on end...not good for your truck and not good for your nerves either.

Bottom line is your truck will barely handle the lightest (no options, little on board load) TM. It's not going to handle a typically equipped/loaded TM and is so underpowered for hill and mountain towing that it will be so slow as to be a safety hazard (as well as incredibly frustrating). I strongly suggest you either trade up to the new Tacoma (the '05 will work well as TM tow vehicle), a Tundra ('03 or newer), or stay with very lightweight trailers (small Coleman popups or ultra light hardwall units such as the ALiner)
__________________
Ray

I use my TM as a base camp for hiking, kayaking, mountain biking, and climbing Colorado's 14ers


The Trailer: 2002 TM Model 2720SL ( Mods: Solar Panels (170 Watts), Dual T-105 Batteries, Electric Tongue Jack, Side AC, Programmable Thermostat, Doran TP Monitor System)

The Tow Vehicle: 2003 Toyota Tundra V8 SR5 4X4 w/Tow Package (Towing & Performance Mods: JBA Headers, Gibson Muffler, 4.30 gears, Michelin LTX M/S Tires, Prodigy Brake Controller, Transmission Temperature Gauge)


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Old 04-13-2005, 02:19 PM   #3
grampa
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RMR and TC,
Thanks for taking time to reply. I appreciate it.
Back in the 80's, when we were rich and famous (haha), we had an 82 dodge van, (318 v8, torgueflite transmission), and a 24 ft coachmen. But not rich and famous anymore. Just retired so have to watch expenses. We were hoping our Tacoma would be enough but, from what you guys have said, and from talking with others, it is obvious that the Tacoma would be barely adequate where we live. Let alone where you guys live. Much to think about. Oh well.
Thanks again, Grampa
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Old 04-13-2005, 05:53 PM   #4
tomr
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I tow a 3023 with a 91 Toyota Tacoma 4 cylinder with a 5 speed. I have taken it from Maine to Georgia and back without any problem. I use a wd hitch and haven't felt much sway. I have found that on steep grades, I have to downshift into 3rd or 4th gear, but other than that I haven't had any problem. I don't fill my water tanks when I drive and I am careful on the weight, but feel comfortable driving so far. I don't think I would want to drive it through the mountains out west, but on level terrain, it's ok.
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