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Old 09-15-2006, 02:49 PM   #1
thewitzclan
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Default Towing my 3023 w/kia sedona

Well, we just came back from our first trip with our 3023. We had a weight dist. set-up for a 600lbs rating installed and we took out 3 of the seats in the van which weigh approx 50 lbs each. The van has a towing rating of 3500 lbs and i know that we were very close to that (if not a little over it). The equilizing hitch sure brought the back end higher but i noticed while we were driving, it felt a little shaky and bouncy at times. Is this anything to worry about? I felt no lack of power at any time. We even removed the 2 propane tanks and the battery from the front to lighten up the load. Thanks for any suggestions.
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Old 09-15-2006, 09:53 PM   #2
skcerny
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Hello there!,

I see you're an east sider! We live in Wixom and have two kids and two greys!!

We have an '05 3023 that we pulled last year with a '05 Dodge Grand Caravan with a factory tow package. The factory package includes all the heavy duty coolers and load leveling. We used the Equalizer WDH and it pulled the TM with no problem here in Michigan as well as our trip to the Smoky Mountains with no problems. Felt like we were pushing on the bigger hills though.

Does your Kia have a factory tow package on it? What type of rear suspension do you have? Could that be beefed up? How are the tires? I'm no means an expert so I'll let those who know more comment on other suggestions.

I will say this though, this year we're pulling the TM with a Mercury Mountaineer with the V8 and factory tow package and it pulled the trailer easily. I took the truck and the trailer along with the family and the two greys to a weigh station and with a full tank of gas, no water, four bikes (2 kids and 2 adults) and all of our gear, the TM registered 4,140 lbs. We had clothes for a week and since we were returning home, most of the food was gone.

Are you by chance heading up to Frankenmuth next weekend for the Trailblazer rally at Jelly Stone?

Regards,

Steve, Kelley, Morgan & Trent
Pebbles, Major
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Old 09-16-2006, 03:10 PM   #3
thewitzclan
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Hi, We had a class 3 trailer package installed by our local camping store (m&m camping) and our sedona has a factory built in transmission cooler. As I stated earlier, i removed the 2 propane tanks and the battery off the trailer to make it lighter. I also removed 3 seats in the sedona. The power wasn't an issue, just the bouncy (almost like in a boat) feeling. The WDH really helped the braking (I also have electronic brake system) but it's like the bak end of the sedona isn't beefy enough. This is the problem that i want to solve. As far as going to Frankenmuth, we haven't discussed it yet. Thanks, Jeff, Cathy, Danny and our 9 1/2 year old Casper(greyhound)
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Old 09-16-2006, 05:53 PM   #4
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Lightbulb I think I understand your problem!

Quote:
Originally Posted by thewitzclan
.... The WDH really helped the braking (I also have electronic brake system) but it's like the back end of the sedona isn't beefy enough.
Back end is "floating"? Could be that you have the WDH torque up too high, and the rear axle unloaded too much. But much more likely, you've simply removed too much tongue weight, and the trailer tries to fall on its *** (lifting the front, and the hitch, and your Sedona's rear axle) every time you hit a bump.

I'm guessing that removal of all that weight from the TM front axle assembly was a BAD IDEA. Without at least 400 lbs tongue weight, your trailer is "tippy" and too likely to tilt upwards in front... which sounds EXACTLY like your problem! Stay with the designed tongue weight, 409 lbs (or more), and use the WDH to balance your axle heights properly.

Much better to be slightly over the Sedona's "official" limit than to have the trailer trying to fall on its Butt, lifting your TV rear axle from the ground.

- - - - -
Proper WDH adjustment:

Before you put on the WDH, measure the height of the Sedona body at the top/center of the wheels. After you put on the WDH, measure again, and adjust the number of spring-bar links to make it so that the front of the Sedona (at the front axle, above the middle of the tires) has gone down by the same distance as the back (at the back axle, also above the middle of the tires). After you've got the proper tongue weight, you might find that your "600 lb" bars aren't up to the job. If you need a bigger WDH, buy one.

"Saving" $200-300 by driving with a too-skimpy WDH (or NO WDH ) is false economy: The $300 upgrade is critical for keeping your $12K trailer, and your $10-15K Minivan, and all of your breakable body parts out of the ditch. SPEND THE MONEY, don't unload the tongue!
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Old 09-16-2006, 06:11 PM   #5
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Hi and thanks for the info. Tomorrow I will put the dual tanks back on and test my WDH again. I was just under the impression that getting rid of the 2 full tanks and the battery box it would help out as far as the towing capacity. The WDH is a Reese hitch that is top quality as far as feedbacks from dealers and hitch shops tell me and the 600 lbs is great for a minivan and 409 tongue weight. I never had a power problem and never felt like i was towing something other than the bobbing feeling at times. Should i put both tanks back on or just 1? I still want to leave the battery box off. Would that be o.k.? thanks again, Jeff
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Old 09-17-2006, 01:02 AM   #6
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Jeff

I looked your Sedona up in Consumers Reports and it weighs 4725lbs and the weight distribution is 57% front axle and 43% rear axle. Removing the three seats adds to that inbalance and means you are probably 700lbs heavier on your front axle than the rear before you hitch up. IMO, you need to put both bottles and the battery back and set your WDH up for better weight distribution. You need enough weight on your rear axle so the TM doesn't push you around when you are descending a hill with transmission braking in lower gears. The things you are experiencing while towing seem wild enough that it will be worth your while to find public scales to use for setting your WDH. IMO Equal weight on both axles would be ideal so long as your front axle is no lighter than before you hitch. If you still get uncomfortable bounce after being properly hitched, a set of AirLift bags in your rear coil springs will solve it.
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Old 09-17-2006, 02:25 AM   #7
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Default I'll second Frank...

You definitely need BOTH propane tanks AND the battery. Your Sedona's tires can handle the weight, your nice hitch can handle the weight.... so put it there!

As Frank points out, if you've removed the rear seat, then it's probably a good idea to use a link less than "normal" on the WDH: your TV rear end is already somewhat floating before you even start. I think he's probably taking it a bit too far to say that a 50/50 split would be "ideal"--- Kia didn't design the Sedona's suspension and brakes to run that way. But somewhat more on the rear is key to solving your problem, and keeping the front end of the TM firmly DOWN via adequate tongue weight is the other key.

I have a slightly unrelated recommendation for towing with the Sedona: Set the Tranny in 4th, don't let it shift to Overdrive. Even with a tranny cooler, you're likely to have lots of slippage in 5th, and that's a bad thing to have when towing (creating unnecessary stress on the tranny gears, wasting engine power, grinding the clutches). A couple extra bucks worth of gas, keeping it in 4th at slightly higher RPMs, is a good trade. A "locked" tranny is a much happier tranny!

It's possible that you'd be getting worse gas mileage in OD anyway-- the slippage wasting more power than the higher RPM "spinning" of the lower gear.
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Old 09-17-2006, 04:41 PM   #8
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My beliefs in 50/50 weight distribution is based on 3 yrs and 20,000mi of towing a 2619 with a Honda Odyssey set up that way and having "0" sway or other problems. 50/50 is secondary however to my belief that your TV needs to be set up based on how it is loaded rather than by following some set formula. Some TM owners have HD pickups that do just fine without a WDH because pickups are forward-weighted when built and they are balanced when their beds are loaded -- they also have HD rear springs. Should one of them decide to carry a 12-1500lb 4-wheeler along in their truck when camping they may need to re-think whether they need a WDH for their TM -- (their truck now has closer to equal weight front and back rather than being 7-800lbs heavier on the front).

My earlier comment about adjusting your WDH was based on the assumption that only two or three people would be riding in the Sedona. If you plan to travel with all 7 or 8 seats occupied you will already be close to equal weight front and rear before adding the TM and should hitch accordingly.
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Old 09-17-2006, 05:39 PM   #9
thewitzclan
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thanks for the valuable info. i just put both propane tanks back on and tomorrow i will try the WDH to see what kind of sag i have. I am also going to call my Kia dealer to inquire about beefier shocks. Thanks again, Jeff
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Old 09-18-2006, 08:10 PM   #10
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I'll second most of these posts. That bouncy floating feeling is ALWAYS (in my experience) due to insufficient tongue weight. A trailer MUST put at least 10% of its total weight on the tongue - the TM's are biased more toward 13-14%, for added stability. If you disturb the tongue weight percent, you are asking for trouble.

I remember renting a U-Haul shortly after I graduated from college, to move my household goods (you know, my stereo and my mattress) to my new job. I put the light stuff in first, then loaded the heavy stuff in last, thinking that it would be easier to get the stuff in and out. When it was all loaded, I had to stand on the hitch coupler to bring it down onto the hitch ball. That trailer bounced and wobbled so much that it nearly threw the car off the road. It was so uncontrollable that I had to unload it and repack it on the side of the highway. Not fun - but it sounds like what you are experiencing.

Moral - don't dork with the hitch weight. If you are messing with it in hopes of gaining more towing capacity, then you have another issue to grapple with entirely.

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