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Old 07-01-2015, 06:16 PM   #1
Skyjim73
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Default Taking delivery of our new 3124KB and first trip

OK, we’ve completed our first real camping trip with the new 3124KB, a run to the North Rim of the Grand Canyon. General observations, which most of you experienced owners likely would consider old news:

The anticipated fuel economy benefits are clearly real! Towing with my V-10 gas hog, from Victorville, CA, to North Las Vegas in very hot conditions, a run which includes the Baker Grade, a fairly grueling climb to a 4000 foot pass in 100 degree plus heat, I was astounded to register a hand-calculated (triple-checked, once by the DW because I frankly did not believe my own numbers...) 16.28 mpg. This with a tow vehicle that struggles to ever crack 17 mpg over any distance without a trailer. Partly it was because I was on a heavily patrolled segment of I-15, so cruised at a quasi-legal 62 mph indicated, slower than I would prefer, but clearly in the fuel economy sweet spot. Higher speeds gave poorer economy, as always, but I never got below 12 mpg even when dicing with semis at 70+ on grades in Nevada and Utah. This with a tow vehicle which never cracked 9 mpg pulling my old hard side 22 footer over the same route.

As regards quality issues, we had to abort taking delivery the first time around in May – there were multiple things wrong or incomplete – some of the incompletes were stuff that stemmed from our unit being one of the first off the Nebraska line with multiple custom and other options. Some stuff like the cassette toilet wasn’t in the production flow at the new factory yet. The compressor fridge was in, but only ran on AC power – not on 12 volt. Custom RV tried to take on the task of completing several items to get it in shape for a trip deadline we had, but when I had multiple ground fault trips in the trailer as soon as I plugged it in at my house – which would not reset, and popped the breaker in my garage circuit, which has had no trouble with my 1996 Prowler for the past 18 years – I was simply done. I’m pretty good with DC systems and their troubleshooting, but have no desire to begin a new ownership experience with a suspect AC system right out of the box. In addition, there were gouged interior pieces, missing trim strips over some of the stapled seam lines inside, the running lights were not working on the front shell, and despite some valiant band-aids by Custom before i left the yard, I now had the feeling that the more we looked, the more issues we were going to find. I was simply done, had no time, and had to regretfully tell Custom to come get the trailer. Much of this was basic stuff which should never have made it out of the factory IMHO. I felt almost physically ill – had I made a huge mistake?

Fast forward to early June and I was ready to go down for delivery version 2.0. This time everything was in place, no AC or DC system weirdness, all the appliances and lights worked OK, and Custom had welded on the brackets for my Andersen No-Sway hitch and done the mods to the battery rails to fit my desired 260 AH batteries. Solar panels were on the roof, the MPPT charge controller was doing its thing, and the 4 AWG charge wiring had been run from the upgraded Progressive Dynamics converter section that had been installed in Nebraska forward to a marine cutoff switch and a main DC breaker mounted on the tongue. We folded things down, and as I was securing the travel latches, one of the aft latch hooks on the upper shell literally came off in my hand. All four bolts appeared to have corroded and failed! While those were being replaced, I quickly gave the others a visual and pull test but the other three seemed ok, so I hitched up and off we went on our maiden voyage…

When we arrived at the North Rim, setup was done slowly and carefully, and it was not until after we were done that I noticed that one of the four gold irridited bolts holding the forward right link arm for the rear shell to the bottom torsion bar was missing. Sort of like finding that the framers forgot to nail a joist in your house to the hangar, right? A quick check revealed two others that were loosened and in danger of leaving, one adjacent to the departed bolt, another on the aft arm on the same side of the aft shell. Both had the lockwashers in place so I can only conclude that they were not properly torqued at the factory. Went around snugging all of them up, and called Custom requesting replacements and a factory recommend torque spec. But honestly at that point I wondered if anybody has actually engineered this thing and bothered to do anything other than consult a standard torque table - which would, I think, result in an overtorque likely to crush the rectangular arm section if i understand the construction. I could be wrong there, but you can be certain that before we hit the road for trip number two, there will be blue lock-tite on all of those bolts!

I have not done any serious searches of fixes to a lot of things we noticed on this first trip that I knew would be irritants to me, but figured I'd live with as part of the tradeoff for the low profile. The seal installation in several places like the door area seems haphazard (there is a gaping gap at the bottom aft door corner that needs some attention to detail IMO), as does the placement of the velcro dots for the forward insulating flaps while in transit. The hasps they use for the bathroom walls seem a crude and cheap approach, and the plastic trim almost designed to fail. Nothing about that setup will prevent those wall panels from "walking" as you experienced folks know. Gotta be a better way. I've got an old buddy who is a mechanisms designer for spacecraft at JPL - I'm going to have him over, ply him with some beers, and challenge him to come up with something clever. He will, but his first several ideas will be hopelessly unbuildable. But maybe after lots of beers and arguments we'll figure out some elegant and robust modifications. Maybe not, but it's worth a try, and the process will be fun

Funpilot, I have no idea if my windows leak, because we had no real weather. I'm REALLY happy with the performance of the compressor fridge, but I screwed up when I placed the trailer in our camp site - should have been about 15 feet farther forward in the pullthrough, and i would have gotten a lot more sun - I'm not yet used to considering the solar panels when placing the rig. Had to run the generator an hour or so each day to keep the batteries nice and happy.

More comment in a second post - this is getting awfully long! But we are off and running, and we can't wait to get out again and learn more (after I locktite those bolts). Lots I already want to change, but while I am very unhappy with the detail work I see from TM, I still like the bones.
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3124KB delivered 5/2015 - early unit from Nebraska. TM installed Dometic compressor fridge, lower battery rails, 4AWG batt cable, and PD converter during build. Custom RV installed cassette toilet, two 260 AH 6V batts, 2 UniSolar 64 solar panels, Morningstar MPPT controller/meter.

Tow vehicle: 2016 Ram 1500 Outdoorsman CC 4x4 3.0 diesel.
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Old 07-01-2015, 08:30 PM   #2
Padgett
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Am curious, where do you carry the pair of T-145s ? In the rear compartment ? They appear to be 3/4" taller than my GC2s but should fit the same way. Are they in a container ?
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Old 07-01-2015, 09:35 PM   #3
Skyjim73
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Padgett, they are on the tongue - I've got a KB with the front bunk, so all I needed to do was get another .75 more depth on the battery rails. Went for an inch just to make sure I would not have any clearance issues with the front lip of the shell coming down. The BCI group format is GC2H - I assume the H is for "high". I've got them in a pair of Seasense 50090641 snaptop plastic battery boxes and went overkill, tying them together with a 2/0 connector cable from Real Goods I had left over from a solar power project. The Seasense boxes were about 12 bucks from amazon and fit the taller batteries nicely.

Jim
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3124KB delivered 5/2015 - early unit from Nebraska. TM installed Dometic compressor fridge, lower battery rails, 4AWG batt cable, and PD converter during build. Custom RV installed cassette toilet, two 260 AH 6V batts, 2 UniSolar 64 solar panels, Morningstar MPPT controller/meter.

Tow vehicle: 2016 Ram 1500 Outdoorsman CC 4x4 3.0 diesel.
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Old 07-02-2015, 05:36 AM   #4
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Skyjim73/FunPilot,
I've read with great interest all the posts you guys make. We are ordering our 3124KD in September for delivery in the spring.
I'm particularly interested in the compressor fridge. How much power (drain on the batteries) does it seem to use? I know this depends on outside air temp (OAT) and such, but did it seem to drain the batteries when towing? I'm planning on installing two 12V Grp 31 deep cycles (110 Ah each).
Keep posting any problems you encounter, I'm taking copious notes.
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Old 07-02-2015, 07:25 AM   #5
funpilot
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Interesting observation on the 12 volt side of the compressor fridge as they miswired mine as well. That means the person who learned from that mistake did not share it with the new facility. I was told it was an easy fix.

As far as battery drain, I have not run it off the battery alone at all. I do not plan to do that when towing as I will do what others have posted instead. Cool down a day or two before on home AC power. Put frozen bottles of water in the fridge before going. I have read that will keep the fridge at about 40 degrees after 7 hours which is a good starting point at the campground.
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2015 3124KD
TV: 2005 Avalanche 1500 with Prodigy P3
Truma On-Demand Comfort Hot Water Heater
Dometic 1110 Compressor Refrigerator
BlueOx SwayPro Hitch
2.5 inch lift kit
Progressive Industries EMS-HW30C
Yada Wireless backup camera
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Old 07-02-2015, 07:32 AM   #6
funpilot
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They do have a consistent pattern of not completing simple things I am now seeing. For example, three of my kitchen drawers' bottom slides were never screwed in to the back wall. The radio frame was not screwed in, just left hanging. They never put the bumper on my sink to protect it from the bed when you slide it in. They did not clean off all the glue on the ceiling left by dirty fingers (came off easily with Dawn), etc.

Granted, these are nominal things but as we all have said are like "Never Events" in the healthcare industry. I have been in healthcare leadership for over 30 years and we have had to get our act together on quality as there is now an extensive list of items that insurers will not pay for if we do something wrong. In my shop we got to zero errors so I know how to get there. Sad, but it is not hard to do. It starts with management owning the problem, and then holding the people who make mistakes responsible. Another simple approach.
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2015 3124KD
TV: 2005 Avalanche 1500 with Prodigy P3
Truma On-Demand Comfort Hot Water Heater
Dometic 1110 Compressor Refrigerator
BlueOx SwayPro Hitch
2.5 inch lift kit
Progressive Industries EMS-HW30C
Yada Wireless backup camera
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Old 07-02-2015, 08:27 AM   #7
Skyjim73
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I was told by Custom RV that the problem was a reversed wiring problem on the DC hookup. Fortunately there appear to have been no ill effects on the fridge.

I have run mine during towing, started with unit well chilled along with contents from a night on AC power prior to departure. Ran the factory fridge fan (it is a bit noisy, but lack of airflow is going to just kill any fridge's ability to reject heat with the TM folded) and transitioned to DC power a few minutes before departure. (Hey, I'm an old rocket/space shuttle guy. The bird waits till the last minute or two prior to T-zero to go on internal power... ).

Living in Southern California, many of my trip profiles will involve tows through hot low elevation environments en route to cooler destinations. The 3 way absorption fridges in RVs I've previously owned typically performed poorly en route to my camping spots, not really staying cold enough for safe meat storage on many trips, even after long pre-chills in the driveway. I installed the solar panels primarily because I wanted to be able to reduce or eliminate battery drain by the compressor fridge during these transits.

With the caveat that I only have one trip to go on, and I may wind up tweaking things like my panel choice and remote meter (I might decide I really need the comprehensive data from a Trimetric or E-meter to manage the battery bank, but the Morningstar remote meter has a lot of data logging capability on daily min/max bank voltage and solar amps in), I'd say that I was happy with both the battery health and fridge temperature (34 degrees on my little hanging thermometer) on camp arrival on this trip. I got a little cocky in fact and was running a second portable compressor fridge in the TM for the first couple of days, but that was pulling me down too fast and I consolidated the contents into the main fridge on day three and ran the generator two one hour stints that day to pour amps back into the batteries. That is where the ability to manually keep the PD 4600 converter in 14.4 V "boost" charge mode (I would have called it bulk charge stage on my old Heart systems) during generator runs while monitoring the battery voltage came in really handy. Having the larger charge cables in place also kept my voltage losses down on the longish run from the converter near the bathroom up to the batts on the tongue.

As noted I got a lot of shade since i didn't do a very good job of placing the rig this time, so more experience is needed. But the panels had me fully charged or very close to it after 550 miles of running through mostly 105 degrees plus conditions with the fridge operating and the fridge fan running.
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3124KB delivered 5/2015 - early unit from Nebraska. TM installed Dometic compressor fridge, lower battery rails, 4AWG batt cable, and PD converter during build. Custom RV installed cassette toilet, two 260 AH 6V batts, 2 UniSolar 64 solar panels, Morningstar MPPT controller/meter.

Tow vehicle: 2016 Ram 1500 Outdoorsman CC 4x4 3.0 diesel.
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