TM Towing Problems

Greetings! The bike rack to got at Camping World looks like swell
solution. Thanks for the info.

The spare tire is stowed under the 2004 2720SD, just forward of the
door.

Michael: Regarding your comment on the folding tongue problem, I am considering a sway control friction unit; and have the same type of tongue .. at least I think so. I have not seen any other TM's to compare; but is your's the one with the large pins on both sides of the A-frame that are verticle? I just got a used 2720sl and have not yet 'played' with this aspect of it as have been busy getting familiar with the rest of it.
Thanks
Paul

Originally Posted by TandemKids

Al,

I installed a receiver on the rear of our TM 2619 so that I could quickly install/remove our tandem bike rack. I have definitely noticed some sway when the tandem is mounted. Fortunately, I still have the friction sway control that I used with our pop-up trailer. Due to the folding tongue of the 2619, I cannot mount the sway control on the right side of the hitch as I would like, so I have ordered a sway control adapter which will allow me move the control to the left side without much adaptation required.

Michael

[RockyMtnRay]

Originally Posted by paul street

I am considering a sway control friction unit

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

First of all, there is absolutely no need to use ANY sway control when towing a properly loaded TrailManor. As discussed earlier in this thread, TMs are inherently very sway resistant (because the axle is well behind the trailer's center of gravity) and as long as you don't put excessive weight well behind the rear bumper (typically by loading several heavy bicycles back there), sway control is totally unnecessary. In fact, TM has specifically advised members of this board to NOT use a sway control because it will mask poor loading.

Friction type sway controls are the devil's own work. If you adjust them so they're tight enough to dampen sway, they're too tight and cause major binding when you need rapid pivoting at the hitch...like going around sharp corners. If you leave them loose enough to allow proper cornering, they are useless. If they get wet during travel in rain, the friction is reduced and they become less effective. DO NOT USE A FRICTION SWAY CONTROL!!!!!!

If you absolutely feel that you must have some kind of sway control, at least get one that uses a cam-action...or a trapezoidal force (like the Hensley Hitch) instead of friction to resist (not just dampen) sway. The advantage of cam action is that it produces a countering force which tends to recenter the trailer behind the TV whenever the trailer moves off the TV/s centerline.

I used to tow my 2720SL with a very short wheelbase Jeep Cherokee (103 inch WB). I never experienced the slightest amount of sway with that TV/trailer combo....even while meeting semi-trucks on 2-lane roads in 50 mph crosswinds. The reason is I always made sure I had the TM properly loaded with minimal weight behind the axle...my hitch weight was around 520 lbs.

Therefore, all you need to tow a 2720SL is a plain (without sway control) but heavy duty WDH (weight distributing hitch)...get one with at least 750 lb spring bars. I have the swing away tongue option on my '02 2720SL and find that Reese WDH bar mounts work just fine...there's no conflict with the swing away hardware. And IMO, a WDH is mandatory for towing a 2720SL if the TV is any half-ton truck/SUV or smaller...and it's a good idea even if the TV is a 3/4 ton truck/SUV.

It can't be emphasized enough that putting bike racks and all kinds of heavy loads behind the axle of a TM is toying with danger! The proper place to carry your bikes is somewhere else, such as on the roofs of your tow vehicles. If you're going to push the center of gravity of your TM to the rear of its axle, you're going to induce swaying.

Recently a familiy in our church was involved in a bad accident that was caused by swaying of their 5th wheeler. When gusts of wind somewhere in Nevada caused the husband to lose control of the trailer, both tow vehicle and trailer rolled over several times. He and his granddaughers had minor injuries but his wife sustained a broken neck. Fortunately she had no paralysis, but had to undergo surgery and wear a "Halo" neck stabilizer for many weeks.

The primary reason most of us purchase TMs is because they have marvelous towing characteristics. Why, then would any TM owner knowingly degrade those characteristics - to flirt with injury and death.

A sway control device may dampen out some side-to-side oscillations caused by a rearward center of gravity. All it may take, however, to overpower your sway controller is a strong gust of wind or any oily patch of roadway. In a few seconds your pleasure trip has turned into a disaster.

I've experienced severe swaying a couple of times while towing small trailers. Both times the trailer was small enough that it couldn't overpower the tow vehicle but, believe me, both occasions were frightening!

[G-V_Driver]

10-4 on no sway control. You shouldn't need one. I would pay anybody (other than maybe Jeff Gordon) who can make mine sway. I had a scary moment on a rainy day in Cheyenne, WY this summer when I was forced to make the most severe evasive maneuver I can ever remember. TM swerved with me, but no more.

If it doesn't sway when it's empty (take your empty trailer out on a deserted stretch of road and try to make it sway. I did and it didn't. Be sure the insurance is effect first.)

If it exhibits sway tendencies when it's full and doesn't when it's empty, you will know that loading is the problem. If it sways when it's empty, check the mechanical condition of the unit.

If your unit sways, and your TV is capable of towing it (consult your TV manual as well as numerous posts on this subject) something else is causing the problem. If the TM is structually sound (tires, wheels, springs, attachments, etc.) it's even more probable that the problem is loading.

An easy way to check (or build) your loading plan is with a bathroom scale and a simple diagram. First, weigh the stuff you know you will take. If possible, and depending on your AQ (anal quotient) write the weight on the object (unobtrusively) with a sharpie so you will know how to rearrange when you get something else that you just can't live without.

You know the axle runs between the wheels, and the wheel wells are under the cabinet. The weight of anything you store behind the cabinets reduces tongue weight and therefore decreases stability. Anything you load forward of the cabinets has the reverse effect. The further forward or back you put it, the more impact it creates on the center of gravity and tongue weight. Once you know what you take and where you put it, you will have a better idea of the impact it will have on stability. And if you move something around, you can SWAG the impact.

Be aware that the fresh water tank is (in my case) ahead of the axles and the grey water tank is aft. So if you leave with a full fresh water tank and return with a full grey water tank, you will have effectively moved the CG aft and thereby reduced the tongue weight. Water weighs 8# per gallon, so 20 gallons of water (160#) could be your single largest weight consideration.

Write down the weights of the stuff you take and keep the list in the TM. Keep another copy in the TV, so if sway starts you can review the list for the most likely culprit. "Oh, darn it, Jane, I inadvertently put my blacksmithing anvil in the back storage compartment rather than on the sofa where I usually store it."

I have the 2720SD and tow with a grand cherokee with the V-8 also. I live in Northern New Mexico at 7400'. We travel throughout Colorado alot. I got the reese sway bar for my rig. I don't get the sway any more and have towed on the interstate at 80 mph before. However I am wonder if I should have gotten a load leveler instead. The back of my jeep almost bottoms out and I have had to replace my shocks on my two year old jeep twice. TM had designed the trailer so most of your weight is right over the axle. You might also try transporting your trailer with empty tanks. But staying at the lower speeds and the sway bar will take car of your problem.

[RockyMtnRay]

Originally Posted by tripdreamer

I have the 2720SD and tow with a grand cherokee with the V-8 also. I live in Northern New Mexico at 7400'. We travel throughout Colorado alot. I got the reese sway bar for my rig. I don't get the sway any more and have towed on the interstate at 80 mph before. However I am wonder if I should have gotten a load leveler instead. The back of my jeep almost bottoms out and I have had to replace my shocks on my two year old jeep twice. TM had designed the trailer so most of your weight is right over the axle. You might also try transporting your trailer with empty tanks. But staying at the lower speeds and the sway bar will take car of your problem.

Dump the sway bar and get a good Weight Distributing Hitch. The WDH will stop the bottoming out by transferring a third of the hitch weight to the front wheels of your Jeep and another third back to the trailer's tires. With a properly adjusted WDH on my regular Cherokee (not the Grand Cherokee) I had plenty of suspension travel on my rear axle and never even came close to wearing out the rear shocks. Once you get some of the hitch weight on the front tires of your Jeep, the sway will go away anyway because the front suspension will have much greater control.

Do NOT use a Load Leveler device such as Air Springs. When you have a heavy weight on the trailer hitch two things happen...the rear of your Cherokee goes down and at the same time the front goes up. If you put Air Springs on to level the Jeep, to match the raised front end the rear gets raised above its normal ride height as well. That, in turn, causes the brake proportioning valve on the rear suspension to mostly close...with the BPV closed, nearly all your braking will now be done by the front brakes which cause them to overheat and warp.

[Denny_A]

Originally Posted by Texas_Camper

Tire pressure is critical. Goodyear Marathons need 50 psi, measured while the tires are cold. The tire pressure should be checked before every trip, and every three days on long tows.
T_C

Leon,

For those of us who live in the frozen TUNDRA regions of the Upper U S, it is necessary to define what the measure of "cold" is.

I'm going with 70 deg F. When I travel in the winter, OAT can be around freezing, either direction. I've found the 42-44 psi is approx. equivalent to 50 psi at 70 F. Probably should calculate the tire volume and use gas tables to devise an equation of "cold" pressure as a function of OAT. But, hey, I'm retired . I'm happy using TLAR*. Update: Using p1/p2 = t1/t2 I get 46.4 psi as the correct pressure equivalent at 32 deg F. Press in lb/in'sq and temp in Rankin [deg F + 460 ]. Assuming constant volume. So, rule of thumb{?}: 1 psi less than 50 for each 10 deg decrease from 70 F OAT.

Further Update 10-4-04: 40 F today. Pressure came in at 45 psi; s/b 47 psi. Will be down to 25 F tonight and up to 70 F on Weds. Futher tests to be conducted!

Also saw a comment about driving speed. Just as a reminder, the GY Marathons on most TM's are rated for 65 MPH max. I NEVER, ever exceed 65 MPH (14" tire, 2720) except to pass on a two lane road - but, maybe that's just me. Same as I never exceeded Vne* in an airplane. Limitations are there to protect the manufacturer (...ermmm..operator?).

Denny_A

*: That Looks About Right / Velocity never exceed.

... for the comments and suggestions regarding a sway control unit. The input was great. But with a small wheel base vehicle, Jeep Liberty, want to cover all my bases once we get our trailmanor on the long road back east. So was able to buy one on ebay tonite. Plan on installing it and getting out for a week-end trip or 2 before embarking. Lot's of 2 lane roads here where we live with big rig tractor trucks loaded down with onions, garlic, alfalfa bales, etc. going in both directions all the time. Should give me a good testing area. Then, if no improvement, or no effect, will simply remove it. Cost for a practically new one, per description, is not that much to worry about. Better safe than sorry for me.
Paul