Leaking grey water tank

Hello,
On my last outing I had the following problem with the grey water tank on my 2004, 2720SL TM. Apparently I did not realize that it was getting full and it started to overflow. I have read on the TM forum that it would back up into the shower tub (which I was monitoring) if not emptied appropriately, but his did not happen in my case. What happened was the water started to leak out of the area underneath the TM where the top of the grey water tank meets the bottom of the TM. I don't think this is normal so I am asking if anyone has had this happen to them and how you handled it (which might remedy the situation for me). I have not tried to "debug" this problem at all since my trailer is in storage now. Just thought I would get some ideas, in advance, from this knowledgable forum. I have sent a note to the TM tech center asking their opinion but have not received a reply yet. I will post the reply when I receive it.
Thanks in advance for your input,
George

I believe the grey water tank is "vented" although I am not sure where the vent is but my 80% confidence guess it that you had water flow out the vent at the top of the tank and there is really nothing wrong with your system. If the flow into the tank was slow enough you might not get the water to back up into the tub or if it did it would slowly drain back out as the tank "leaked" from the vent. I don't have my book handy but even if I did I am not sure there is a good diagram of that system in there but BILL probably has one in his archieves!
Bill

[Bill]

George -

Unfortunately I have experienced what you describe. There was a break in the plumbing at the top of the tank - I'm not sure precisely where. I took it to the dealer, who removed the tub and tried to find the break, the idea being to goop a handful of epoxy over it. That would have been a perfectly good solution, but unfortunately, the break was somewhere that couldn't be accessed, even with the tub removed, so it still leaked when I got it back. I ended up taking the TM to the factory for their repair. I am under the impression that they actually chiseled and sawed the old tank out from under the floor, and replaced it with a new one.

It was a good repair, and it was done quickly - the folks at the factory are just great! But I did have to get the TM to the factory. Perhaps, having done it there, the factory could walk your dealer through the procedure.

Since my TM was new, this was a warranty repair. I'm not sure that would be true on a 2004 model, since the leak is apparently new. You might want to try the "remove the tub" approach first.

Bill

[ripp1202]

Yes I have !!!!!! It is the fittings going into the top of the gray water tank and they are not fun to fix !!!! One fitting comes from the front sink and one fitting from the tub shower!!! and WHAT I found was the ABS fitting were not glued to the top of the tank properly .Not much glue applied when installed and thats where they were leaking when the tank was full. Same as you' We were camping last fall at Silver Lake ,Mich. at a Jelly Stone for the week and keep see water leaking from the top of the gray water tank ! When we got home started to look where it could be leaking from, took out the panel box and you can see the tub drain going into the tank had to cut the wall to get to that one The one from the front sink you have to take the tub out .The molding around the tub comes off and the tub is screwed to the walls don't forget to to take the drain off the tub, you can access the drain from outside the trailer to remove it, Towel bar must come off too then I cut the ABS pipe, used a cast iron band coulping to put it back together after I clean and reglued the fittings into the top of the tank then check for leaks NO LEAKS What I found was that the top of the tank falls down a 1/2" or so when not full and as it get full it expands up that 1/2" ,so those two fitting better be glued RIGHT or they will leak when you have a full tank! One thing good is that the fitting are so, That the tank will only leak when it is full. The water going down the drains goes right into the tank and will not leaking till you are full or close to it!!!! This FIX is not fun to do ,Not much room in the hall or bath room and a lot of work! JUST BECAUSE OF TWO POORLY GLUED FITTING !!!!!! E-mail me if you have more question The Rip NOW I get the water to back up into the tub

[ripp1202]

The tank is vented with one of those one way vents off of the tub drain behind the panel box! Air admittance valves http://www.oatey.com/aav_public/index.html

Originally Posted by dawkinsgj

Hello,
Apparently I did not realize that it was getting full and it started to overflow. I have read on the TM forum that it would back up into the shower tub (which I was monitoring) if not emptied appropriately, but his did not happen in my case.
George

George,

It was likely my post from last summer that you were referring to.

In my situation I think that the tank reached the overflow condition rather rapidly as it occurred when my daughter was washing the dishes. She knew we had hook-ups for the first time, so concluded that there was no need to conserve water. She did not know that I had connected the water supply but had not yet gotten around to connecting the sewer line. Besides that, I explained that you don't leave the sewer line open. You keep it closed and drain it as it gets at least somewhat full.

I never noticed a leak in the plumbing, but I also did not look for any leaks. When I saw the water in the tub I immediately drained the tank.

[B_and_D]

We've had the same problem too...when we're dry camping and the tank gets really full, the water leaks out somewhere near the top of the grey water tank. It's just a slow drip, but it's not supposed to do that.

Thanks to everyone else who has posted, because now I know where to look first.

Our solution has been to not let the tank get that full. I'm not sure that, at least for us, it's worth pulling off the tank for the repair. If the water backs up in the drain, well, it's time to dump. We keep our little blue tote quite busy when we're dry camping. However, if I had a new TM under warranty, I'd sure take it back for someone else to repair!

Perhaps all the new owners should put this on their list of things to test out when they take their new TM's out for their maiden voyage, and test for the remainder of the warranty period.

Hello again,
I appreciate the great help from all of you. I have listed the "facts" as I understand them based on your input. Also based on your input, I have listed my options for a repair or a "work-around".

The "facts" (with respect to my 2004, 2720SL):
A. The grey tank should not leak at the joint where it enters the TM bathroom.
B. This problem has occurred with at least a few (two or three) others who have let their grey tank overfill. That is, they have observed a leak as I described in my original note. (As one respondent suggested, it may be wise to test for this leak by purposely overfilling the grey tank).
C. Most likely, the connection between the top input of the tank and the bath tub has not been sealed properly or for some reason has deteriorated to the point that it is no longer sealed properly.
D. As those who have affected a repair themselves will attest, it is a slow and tedious job.

I had a telephone conversation with the TM technical leader, Ed Lytle. He confirmed the following:
...that the problem has been reported a few times (and, when still under warrantee, repaired through an authorized dealer)
...that it should not leak
...that it would overflow into the tub if allowed to overfill
...that it could be caused by a deteriorated joint, which could be repaired (with difficulty and lots of time, as those of you who implemented a repair reported)
...that it could be caused by a stress crack, which might not be so "easily" repaired or might require replacement of the tank
...that the "tube" (or pipe) from the bathtub fits "inside" the grey tank so the water going down the drain will go directly into the tank (in other words, if the seal is bad, the water should not leak onto the ground until the tank is full

My options (in no particular order):
1. Work around the problem. That is, don't repair the connection but be sure to dump before the tank can fill to overflow as everyone, even Ed from TM factory, believes that the sole source of the leak is the connection at the top of the tank, implying that it will not leak if it does not fill to that level. I tend to agree with this if it is due to a deteriorated connection. However, if it is a stress fracture, it could get worse over time, eventually requiring replacement. I tend to think it is most likely not a stress fracture since everyone was able to have the joint repaired or did it themselves. Hence, I am not overly concerned with getting it fixed immediately, or maybe ever.

2. Repair it myself. Some of you have offered more detailed information on how to go about this if I ask. Also, Ed (from the factory) has offered a technical guy to work with me over the phone (which I am sure would be a long conversation) if I decide to repair it myself.

3. Since I purchased my TM used, I also purchased an Extended Warranty from a third party vender. I know that some of these EW's are not worth their price but I plan to see if it will cover (less the deductible) this repair. I will definitely report it to the vendor and see where that leads.

I consider this case solved and closed. Thanks again for your input.

Regards,
George

Does anyone know what it cost to replace a gray water tank? We found out on our first outing the next morning it was leaking very disappointing

[Bill]

Cowboy -

I don't know, but I imagine that complete replacement is neither cheap nor easy. It would probably involve cutting out (i.e., destroying) the old tank, and prepping a new one with appropriate piping, etc. If you can get access to the leak, then I think you could just smear some JB Weld or some similar epoxy product into the leaky point. Apparently it is not too hard to lift the tub, which gives you access to most (but not quite all) of the gray-water plumbing.

You didn't tell us the model or year of your unit (bad cowboy!), but I assume it is out of warranty?

Bill