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Old 08-27-2022, 03:57 PM   #1
JohnMD
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Default LED Replacement Bulb Issue with F150

Hi all,

I would like to share an interesting issue that came up.

As shown in my signature, we have a 2007 3023QB towed with a 2017 F150.

Background -- In the spring, I replaced all of the exterior incandescent bulbs with LED bulbs. Prior to our first trip, our truck was in an accident and we ended up using a Ram 2500 rental to tow throughout the summer. After four months of waiting for a replacement seatbelt for our F150, we finally got it back from the collision center.

Issue -- Last weekend, we took our first trip since getting our F150 back. While driving, I began receiving erroneous error message fromthe truck's display. Through trial and error, I determined the following:

When TM running lights were on, braking caused the "Trailer Disconnected" alert, despite fully functioning lights. Using turn indicators caused the "turn indicator fault: check lamps" alert, despite indicators functioning fine. I had kept all of the incandescent bulbs as backups, so I switched out the brake/turn signal bulbs, but this did not help. I then switched all of the exterior bulbs back to the incandescent bulbs, including the running lights, and the problem went away and everything works fine.

Diagnosis -- due to my actions and some internet searching, I believe the issue is that the LED bulbs don't draw enough power for the truck's computer to recognize them, and I guess the scenario of the running lights being on has an impact on this.

Solutions -- (1) keep the incandescent bulbs in and forget about it. (2) Buy one of these to see if it works: Link to an Curt LED adapter I don't like that this would be hanging down and cannot find an adapter without the extra cord length, though I haven't called an RV place yet. (3) I've read that some people wire in resisters by the light fixtures to remedy this.

Questions -- I am wondering if switching out the actual light fixtures with LED fixtures, rather than the bulbs, would cause the same erroneous alerts. Has anyone else experienced this? Those of you with similar model year F150's, do you have LED exterior lights on your TM?

In the end, I like the look of the LED's better, but am fine with the incandescent bulbs. I am concerned, however, that if in the future we get a new trailer with LED's I'll need to actually address this. But, our plan is to use our current trailer as long as possible.

Just thought I would share this experience and see what insight you have.

Thanks again to all of the regular posters on the forum for giving me a nice diversion from work in the evenings. I truly enjoy this forum!

John
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Old 08-27-2022, 07:12 PM   #2
Bill
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I'm not sure why you want to replace the incandescent bulbs with LEDs. The usual advantage of LEDs is the low power draw, but if they are being powered by the truck engine/alternator, you don't care about low power. While I agree with your diagnosis of LEDs not drawing enough current, I wouldn't put much effort or cash into trying to fool the truck's sensors.

Just my thought. I would go with the easy solution now, and worry about the future lights when the future arrives.

Bill
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Old 08-27-2022, 10:07 PM   #3
Shane826
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It’s interesting that the Ford monitors the trailer lights. Install CAN-Bus* LED bulbs. They have a higher resistance so as to not confuse the truck’s computer into thinking the bulb is blown. That said, more and more trailers are now built with LED lights. I find it hard to believe your truck wouldn’t work with them. Maybe there is a setting buried somewhere in the DIC to switch between LED or incandescent trailer lights? If you want to PM me your VIN I can do some digging on the Ford service website. Or maybe it’s something you can adjust with the Ford Scan app?

*DO NOT use CAN-Bus LEDs on your camper anywhere that is powered by the camper battery. Resistance goes up, then amp draw has to go up as well, negating any power savings of switching to LEDs.
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Old 08-28-2022, 11:02 AM   #4
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Quote:
we have a 2007 3023QB towed with a 2017 F150
Quote:
more and more trailers are now built with LED lights. I find it hard to believe your truck wouldn’t work with them.
FWIW:
o We tow with a 2014 F150 - older than yours, so more likely to have limitations.
o My 2020 TM has LED lights all around the exterior, so more likely to cause the sensing problems you describe.
o We have no problems in this whole area.

Shane may be correct - there could be a hidden setting somewhere. If so, I would guess that others have experienced this problems, and an Internet Search should turn up any discussions. Failing that, only your dealer knows for sure - and I often doubt the dealers.

Good luck. As I said, I would just leave it in the working condition you described, and not worry about your next truck or your next TM.

Bill
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Old 08-28-2022, 03:53 PM   #5
JohnMD
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill View Post
I'm not sure why you want to replace the incandescent bulbs with LEDs.
Bill
I wanted to have some extra bulbs on hand for our summer trips, so I figured I would replace with brighter, longer-lasting LEDs and keep the old incandescent bulbs as spares while on the road.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shane826 View Post
It’s interesting that the Ford monitors the trailer lights. Install CAN-Bus* LED bulbs. They have a higher resistance so as to not confuse the truck’s computer into thinking the bulb is blown. That said, more and more trailers are now built with LED lights. I find it hard to believe your truck wouldn’t work with them. Maybe there is a setting buried somewhere in the DIC to switch between LED or incandescent trailer lights? If you want to PM me your VIN I can do some digging on the Ford service website. Or maybe it’s something you can adjust with the Ford Scan app?

*DO NOT use CAN-Bus LEDs on your camper anywhere that is powered by the camper battery. Resistance goes up, then amp draw has to go up as well, negating any power savings of switching to LEDs.
This is interesting information. I was not familiar with CAN-Bus LED bulbs, but I now see that they are probably what I should have purchased in the spring. I think I understand that they are basically an LED with a built-in resistor? From my internet searching, I know this has come up on some other forums. What is the "Ford Scan app?"


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill View Post
FWIW:

Good luck. As I said, I would just leave it in the working condition you described, and not worry about your next truck or your next TM.

Bill
Yep, that's my plan. I'll keep the LED bulbs in my storage box in case a bulb burns out on a trip...dealing with erroneous error messages is tolerable for a short time until a trip ends and a new bulb can be purchased.

In the meantime, I am still left curious as to whether the replacement LED bulbs draw a different amount of power than the LED fixtures installed on newer trailers...and if I would have the issue on a newer trailer.

Anyway, thanks again!

John
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Old 08-28-2022, 08:54 PM   #6
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Bill- Does your 2014 truck “recognize” when there is a trailer is connected? These newer “smart” trucks are way more sensitive to stuff like this.

JohnMD- ForScan (sorry, autocorrect) is an app/software that you can download on your compute/tablet/phone and use with a wireless OBD dongle and have pretty damn close to a factory scan tool. Read codes and data in all
modules, I believe you can command functions on/off for diagnostic purposes, and turn option codes on and off. I have the FCA version, Alfa OBD for my Ram truck. It let me program the VIN to a used ECM, turn on daytime marker lights, turn on Bambi mode (fog lights don’t drip out with high beams), global window down (roll windows down via remote), and so on and so forth. Someday if my DEF tank falls of and the 36 gallon Hemi fuel tank somehow gets stuck under my truck, I’ll be able to recalibrate the fuel gauge and range. It’ll let you recalibrate the speedometer for different tire sizes. I have it on my cheapo Android phone (along with my rearview camera and TPMS for the trailer) and keep it in the truck just in case. I’m pretty sure ForScan is very similar.

https://forscan.org/home.html
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Old 08-29-2022, 07:45 AM   #7
Bill
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shane826 View Post
Bill- Does your 2014 truck “recognize” when there is a trailer is connected? These newer “smart” trucks are way more sensitive to stuff like this.
Yes, it does. In fact, it may be able to distinguish different trailers, since it always identifies the TM as "Default trailer". I'm not sure of that, however.

I assume - but I don't know - that it recognizes that a trailer is connected by looking for continuity in one of the light circuits.

Incidentally, the brake controller is built into the truck. I didn't have to add one.

Quote:
ForScan is an app/software that you can download on your compute/tablet/phone and use with a wireless OBD dongle and have pretty damn close to a factory scan tool. Read codes and data in all
modules, I believe you can command functions on/off for diagnostic purposes, and turn option codes on and off.
Wow, I had no idea such a thing existed! The BT dongle is a little pricey, but I prefer doing things in my Windows laptop anyway, so no big deal there. Love it!

Bill
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