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Old 01-29-2006, 08:11 PM   #1
pbuck1
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Default home theater in a TM?

Bought a 17" widescreen lcd tv for the TM last week to replace the old 9" CRT we used. Now would like to get a small HTiB (Home Theater in a Box) system to install so we can watch DVDs with much better (not necessarily louder) sound than the TV speakers give.
Has anyone installed a home theater system? (I see BobRederick has home theater system in his signature)
The following questions come to my mind:
-Where to put the TV and 5.1 speakers in a 2720SL? This is where I wish we had a 2720SD - I could put the TV in the middle of the front cabinet between the existing TM speakers and watch while lying back along the two sofas. The front, center and rear speakers would go in their traditional positions. However, in a 2720SL the sofa is at right angles compared to the SD so viewing is either across the short side of the TM or at an angle to above the reefer. Any suggestions?
- One option is to mount the TV (and maybe even speakers) to drop down from the front ceiling of the rear shell. They could even be "permanent" installations if they ended up in the gap above the sofa when the rear shell is down. Has anyone wired into the ceiling? Existing wiring runs front to back in the wiring channel. Is this already full, or is there room to run additional cables? How does existing wiring run from side to side in the shell roof sections, e.g. to the antenna or the 12V lights over the sink, stove and bed? Could additonal wires be run fairly easily in this direction, too?
- Where is a good place for a small subwoofer box?

Maybe all this might be very difficult to accomplish, but I really would like to try instead of having to set up 6 speakers every time, so any tips would be appreciated.

I shall now brace myself for the comments from those who find this just too decadent (it does rain from time time to time, you know and it gets dark, too).

Paul
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Old 01-29-2006, 08:41 PM   #2
BobRederick
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Paul

Not decadent at all IMO!! Else I am decadent! I think of it as a Grandkid trap. I can have movies in my camper and have the grandkids come over. Sly old fox, I am. Fresh sliced mango works too! :-))

Check this link out. You might have to go to samsclub.com and do a search on "philips" which is what I did. This unit is also available (in black) at Costco with the model 3400. :
http://www.samsclub.com/eclub/main_s...:-40386:925637

I have a current meter in my TM and this system, running nicely off 12V using a 400 Watt inverter draws 4.5 amps. So I can easily watch a 2 hr movie and have reserve to run the furnace all night safely while dry camping. The unit weighs something like 29# total. It has all speakers including a passive subwoofer. I think it is GREAT for the TM application.

Technically, it uses a new digital amplifier technology in which the audio waveform is sampled at a high rate and the power amplifiers pulsed on and off digitally. For a high voltage point in the music waveform, the duty cycle approaches 100%. For a low voltage instant, it approaches 0% duty cycle. In this way, amplifier power dissipation is nill and battery power is efficiently converted to sound power. As a freeby to this technology, the amplifiers don't get hot and therefore can be in a small case. IMO, this thing was designed for dry camping in a TM!! And sound quality isn't all that bad. My ears quit at a pretty low frequency, so I don't notice the absence of 20 KHz cutoff. Philips advertises 14 KHz at 3 dB if memory serves. It also has a "sleep" mode where you can get it to run in 15 minute increments up to 90 or so minutes, then turn itself off. So I love to go to bed with music and this is just the ticket.

Now for installation. I put mine in the TM in my back yard and ran it a little. Then my wife got sick and I put it in her room for her entertainment. I didn't get it installed. My TM couch faces the refrigerator and at this time, we have a 10.2" portable DVD player that I use for videos sitting on the couch table right in front of the viewers. At some point, I will be putting in a (hopefully HD) TV that will sit on or in front of the refrigerator. I haven't done any wiring yet, only thinking about it. The back speakers, of course can be those in the TM cabinet and the wiring is already run. The fronts -- I don't know. The left channel will be over by the door somehow.

I picture a hanging cabinet with the amplifier mounted by the cieling. It will have a shelf below where I can charge my model plane batteries, cell phones, PDA, shaver, etc. That will get some of the electronics and wiring off the refrigerator. This cabinet will have to come down for travel. It should be placed on the couch for a nice soft ride.

I hope this helps. Keep us posted on your installation. I want to know how yours comes out.
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Old 01-30-2006, 05:43 AM   #3
rockerga
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I am working the installation out in my mind and I have so far come to the conclusion of making my own TV shelf (With accessories from TM just like the shelf in the bedroom area) except slightly longer/wider. I am going to mount it in front of the refrigerator (closer to the couch) at the same height as the existing counter. The wiring for the "front" speakers and the speaker themselves will be attached to the ceiling with velcro. The wiring can go straight up from the LCD tv to the ceiling so as not to be in the way and then run taut to their respective speakers. Panduit and other manufacturers make very sticky adhesive "mounts" for velcro straps. These mounts I am thinking can be permanent as they are on the "inside" box when closed. The existing rear speakers would be utilized. I am looking at the same Surround system as Bob Rederick due to the light weight and small size of the satellite speakers. This is a project I want to complete withing the next month. My son is a high-end home theatre designer and installer. I will enlist him and advise all once we have completed for all to know. IDEALLY: I am really looking at a 2 system set-up: 1 in the rear (bed) compartment and 1 in the main living area with the wiring all done from below if possible... I will let you know when we have completed this adventure.
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Old 01-30-2006, 10:45 AM   #4
Freedom
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What about wireless surround sound? I'm not into that type of stuff, but I'm sure I saw something at COSTCO about it. There are also wireless surround sound headphones. IMHO that would be a lot easier than wiring in a TM. TMs are not real conducive to adding wiring - or repairing wiring for that matter!
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Old 01-30-2006, 11:02 AM   #5
BobRederick
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Jim

Wireless is a good idea, but you will now have to
a) provide power to each remote speaker -- that means wiring.
b) account for the weight of all these systems -- which might be small

The small amplifier/speaker technology used for iPods is attractive.
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Old 01-30-2006, 11:09 AM   #6
rockerga
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Default Wired vs wireless

Quote:
Originally Posted by Freedom
What about wireless surround sound? I'm not into that type of stuff, but I'm sure I saw something at COSTCO about it. There are also wireless surround sound headphones. IMHO that would be a lot easier than wiring in a TM. TMs are not real conducive to adding wiring - or repairing wiring for that matter!
It's all about sound quality reproduction. if you are talking about hi-fi television or background music then by all means wireless will work for you. To gain true surround sound in todays standards of either "Dolby" or "THX" then you have to have a "wired" system. We are not talking volume, but rather the quality of and from where the sound eminates.

If you are putting in a nice LCD TV with a DVD player and/or a cable hook-up at a camp-site that offers 5.1 surround (Broadcast standard today: 1-center channel, 2-front speakers, 2 rear surround speakers and 1- subwoofer) you will need a wired system to "appreciate" the nuances of the audio track to match the intended audio effect.

I am a musician and audiophile so sadly my ears have heard the best and I cannot go back to the days of dancing to good ole transister radios and be satisfied.
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Old 01-30-2006, 11:21 AM   #7
rockerga
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobRederick
Jim

Wireless is a good idea, but you will now have to
a) provide power to each remote speaker -- that means wiring.
b) account for the weight of all these systems -- which might be small

The small amplifier/speaker technology used for iPods is attractive.
The weight of the smaller "surround sound In a box" type systems would be for the most part negligible which is what you would want also from a size standpoint as well: Not much headroom or footspace to be placing large speakers about.

Wireless would mean no wires to the individual speakers and therefor is the reason for the lack of quality sound reproduction.
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Old 01-30-2006, 12:47 PM   #8
Bill
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pbuck1
<snip> One option is to mount the TV (and maybe even speakers) to drop down from the front ceiling of the rear shell.
Paul -

I think you have already decided against this, and that's probably wise. I imagine that anything permanently mounted to the ceiling would be subject to a lot of shock and vibe as you travel ...

Bill
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Old 01-30-2006, 01:15 PM   #9
rockerga
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill
Paul -

I think you have already decided against this, and that's probably wise. I imagine that anything permanently mounted to the ceiling would be subject to a lot of shock and vibe as you travel ...

Bill
It would actually not be permanent in either the wired or wireless forms whichever was decided. The "mounts" could be permanent but the speakers and head-end unit (amplifier) as the television etc., or like everything else placed in a safe positition before take-down.
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Old 01-30-2006, 01:25 PM   #10
BobRederick
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Talking

Ron
Wireless doesn't have to mean low quality sound. I believe some high-end home theaters now use that technology. Probably the biggest limitation to quality in a wireless systems is the bandwidth of the data stream and with sufficient bandwidth, quality should be achievable. Of course more higher quality always costs more.

Bandwidth of the subject Philips system, which is wired, is about 14 KHz which a purist audiophyle would probably find unsuitable. In the Phillips case, I am pretty sure the bandwidth is limited by the sampling rate. The highest bandwidth is half the sampling rate (Nyquist's theorem) and in practice one can only approach half the sampling rate. We would be talking about maybe a 40 KHz sampling rate for audio rolloff at 14 KHz. Sampling rate in turn is limited by the speed of the semiconductors doing the sampling. Apparently power devices have become available to support 40 KHz sampling.

Linear amplifiers do not do sampling and can support more bandwidth. The advantage of digital amplification (sampling) is low power consumption and accompanying small size.

So its just like many other camping decisions: It isn't ideal, but it is a compromise. It makes camping more interesting to find an array of compromises to get a desired effect outdoors. I think it is a real kick to be watching a video out in the boondocks where I am miles from hookups and not even running the generator.
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