Interesting RV Solar Info

[greentrail]

Hey guys,
I was shopping generators which led to dreaming about solar and came across this link:

http://handybobsolar.wordpress.com/2009/07/22/solar-power-that-works/

It has a lot of useful information about solar and how to make it work. Hope it helps you also.

Thanks!

[ZekenSpider]

Hey guys,
I was shopping generators which led to dreaming about solar and came across this link:

http://handybobsolar.wordpress.com/2009/07/22/solar-power-that-works/

It has a lot of useful information about solar and how to make it work. Hope it helps you also.

Thanks!

Really good information. It sure confirms everything I know about the subject.

Thanks for the post.

Jerry

[rumbleweed]

Here is another link with tons of great info not only on solar, but on batteries and their care and use. I have purchased from these guys and they are great to work with. Scroll down for the info on the various subjects.

http://www.windsun.com/

[greentrail]

You've peaked my interest. What have you purchased? Did you build an array for the TM? I was considering building a portable 125 watt system with a charge controller but then I came across this:

http://www.protonex.com/recreation/index.aspx

This spring they are rolling out a 250 watt fuel cell for recreation use. I'm really interested in learning more about it. Seems like a good compromise, reliability of a generator (don't have to count on the sun) but quieter, cleaner and more efficient.

[rumbleweed]

I have a 2 65 W Panels and a 10 amp controller feeding a deep cycle AGM battery. They are not mounted for two reasons. 1. Use it as a portable power source for non TM applications 2. Most of the time I park TM is the shade. When camping I mount panels on PVC rack to allow me to place them in the best sun, Power cell looks ery interesting, but my guess is not inexpensive.

[greentrail]

That sounds cool. Do you have the panels hinged together on a cart and then they fold open or do you just prop them up individually. I really like the ideal of solar.. seems like the best choice over a generator and maybe less prone to theft vs a generator. However, I'm challenged with transport. I have a truck but it seems the panels would limit my truck storage. Maybe they could be stored on the beds of the trailmanor???

I'll post an update on the fuel cell, I'm on their update list. I bet you are right, it won't be inexpensive. Seems though I could get into solar for less than a honda, maybe around 6 bills for a good panel and charge controller

[rumbleweed]

Attached are some pics of the panel mount I use. It is made from 3/4" PVC. It allows me to place easily where it gets the most sun. I leave enough joints unglued to take it apart so it will store flat. The string helps take some of the strain off the back brace joint . It is very light and very portable. I have several sets of cables depending on what I am using it for. In addition to running the TM, I use it to run a full size thermo-electric cooler, and charge LIPo batteries for my RC helis ( 10 amps during charge). I store it in original shipping boxes on floor of TM (standing up) during travel.
Parts list
2 sections 3/4" PVC
6 3/4" T's
6 3/4" 90 Elbows
2 3/4" end caps ( Optional)

[Bill]

Bob -

That's a nice job with the racks. I kept mine portable for the same reasons you did. I made my racks out of aluminum angle stock, bolted directly to the frame of the panels, but I suspect that your PVC approach is easier to build. Mine are shown in posts #35 and #38 in this thread
http://www.trailmanorowners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1034

Greentrail, carrying them isn't bad as long as you don't allow anything to press on the glass face and crack it. I built a lightweight protective slipcase for each panel, and they ride standing up in the TM hallway. There's a picture in the post listed above.

As for the cost effectiveness of solar panels? It is pretty hard to make the case for solar on the basis of cost alone. A pair of 80-watt panels will cost about $1000, and you get 160 watts out of them only under ideal conditions - and usually less. By contrast, you can buy a 1000-watt Honda super-quiet generator for about $600, and get 800 watts continuously. A generator will provde more energy in an hour than a pair of panels will produce in an entire sunny day, and of course if the day isn't sunny, the panels produce nothing. And I doubt that panels are less likely to be stolen, unless they are hard-mounted on the roof of the TM.

There are many other reasons to go solar, of course - but cost isn't it.

Bill

[rumbleweed]

Bill

Checked your posts. Racks look nice. I agree on the cost. Not cost effective, but much greener and quieter.

[Jim&Joan]

Can some of the users of solar give us an indication of the operation and maintenance costs of their solar systems? Also, what kind of 'TM world' experience on life span of the components (panels and controllers)?

I would think that generators likely require more maintenance. Obviously you have fuel costs. There is also a cost related to the weight and space to haul a generator. How do current (pardon the unintentional pun) users think weight and space of solar compare to a generator?

Generator users - I am not too familiar with them in general - Do you use gasoline or diesel fuel? How do you handle fuel storage?

Just kind of wondering if the costs over time tend to balance out the initial outlay difference.

[greentrail]

Thanks Bill,
For me going solar would be more cost effective because I decided if I'm going to get a generator I am going to get a 3K or better honda one that can run the air and I can use as backup at home. Generators seem such a pain for just charging batteries especially if you start to calculate how much time it needs to run to replenish the battery bank even if you use a IOTA or Truecharge, even longer with just charging from DC output.

Lastly, just this year I experienced a few hours of a camping neighbor kitty corner across the way running a 1K honda for a few hours. I really didn't like it and I found myself getting angry over the "quiet noise" The only saving grace around my area are the guys with the generators tend to pack their whole home and when the rain hits they pack up and go home. Normally I don't like rain but I was happy to see it come that day and that generator go....After that experience I don't want to do that to anyone, even with a quiet honda. That's why solar or this new fuel cell is so appealing to me.

[rumbleweed]

A real quick conservative set of data points to use. The real question is what is your electricity demand. A panel and controller should last 15 -20 yrs. Probably will replace with a more efficient one by then. Battery should last 3-5 yrs depending on how it is used.
2 80 watt panels approx $1000
1 controller approx $70
Battery deep cycle approx 150-200

With this you will get approx 400-600 WHr per sunny day if properly placed
Assume 1/2 of the days you camp are sunny unless you live in Seattle (sorry)
If this meets your needs Approx $1200 ( + 300 for batteries) will supply you for 15 years. Look up the current requirement for the devices you use and multiply by the time of use in a day. Then add all those up to get your total demand. Keep in mind that the battery capacity needs to be able to meet your demand and accept the 400 - 600 watt hours of charge.

A generator should last 10-15 yrs and cost you about $700 ( Honda 1000) You need to add gas @ $1.25 per hour and some maint $25.

A down side of the Solar is that if the 4 days you are camping have no sun, you can not replace your usage.

[PopBeavers]

I bought the Honda 2000 in March 2005, when I bought the TM. So far I have not serviced anything.

I run it for about an hour per day when camping. A pint of gasoline will run it for 45 minutes.

I store the fuel in the same MSR bottles from REI that I use for Coleman fuel when I go backpacking. April 2008 we added motorcycles and ATVs, so I now have a lot of gasoline with me.

It is best to charge in the morning, instead of letting the drained batteries sit all day. So I run it while cooking breakfast, around 8 AM. Anyone walking their dog on the paved campground loop road will not be able to hear my generator. I keep it on the side of the TM that is away from the road. If you can hear my generator then you are trespassing in my spot. ;)

If I ever have a need to run the a/c, then I will buy a second Honda 2000.

I can not lift a Yamaha 2400. The Honda 2000 is the biggest I can deal with.

[greentrail]

My ears must be just too good. I was in my campsite and his generator was behind his camper back in the woods doing the best he could the distance was at least 20 yards and it was clear as day. I will say though we were in a sparsely populated primitive campground. I bet in a full campground with all the hustle and bustle I wouldn't have heard it.

[PopBeavers]

Perhaps it was not on econo mode. I only take it off of econo mode to run the microwave.

[greentrail]

No, I need to attend more loud music venues and not use ear plugs when mowing ha ha ha.....It was in econo mode because I could hear it go up and down when the electric range kicked on and off during breakfast and lunch....

[PopBeavers]

No, I need to attend more loud music venues and not use ear plugs when mowing ha ha ha.....It was in econo mode because I could hear it go up and down when the electric range kicked on and off during breakfast and lunch....

When I am running my generator, the only loads are:

converter
water pump (briefly)
CO detector
propane detector
toilet flush (briefly)
CD on the radio maybe
recharge cell phone maybe

the only time it rises above the lowest RPM is if we use the microwave. In two years that has happened three times.

We have no television. We have no computer. We have no electric appliances, other than the microwave.

I could have gotten by with a Honda 1000.

I can get by with less power, but I call that backpacking. And these days I usually only go backpacking once a year.