Beware

[curlyontop]

Beware the Elkmont...My husband and I bought a 2010 in ay of this year and have had nothing but problems. We have had 5 (five) total leaks in only 2 (two trips). We are totally dissatisfied and would love to have our 1995 Coleman Sun Ridge back!!!!

[Scott O]

Welcome to the forum! I'm not sure this is a really good place to vent, but if you can give us some specific problems maybe the group can come up with some specific solutions. There is a tremendous amount of expertise here, so give us a chance. And don't give up on your TM.

[B_and_D]

I'm sorry to hear that you have had so many problems with your Elkmont, we saw a couple of them at the TM Rally in Petaluma in October and they are gorgeous. We noted that the people who bought them had some issues, but the guys at Custom RV (apparently our only remaining TM dealer here in California) were actively doing what needed to be done to rectify the situation. TM does stand behind their product, but it can be a hassle (and very disappointing) to have to drag it to the dealer for repairs instead of using it to go camping when you buy it. I hope you can get your leaks fixed without too much hassle and be on your merry way to the campgrounds soon.

Has your dealer been helpful with the repairs?

D'

[ib4classics]

We went on a factory tour this November and watched Elkmonts under construction. When they were completed each had a water leak test at the end of the assembly line.
They put an oscilating sprinkler on the roof for about 2 hours, near the end of which staff went inside with flash lights and took their time to look over every inch of the trailer.
This "rain fall" test may not have been a gully washer but it shows they check every unit that they build.
Our feeling is that as a family owned company, they stand behind their product and do care about their reputation.

[Nature Recorder]

I am the proud owner of an Elkmont since July and feel I should say spmething. I 'can say I have had no leak issues with my trailer. Living in the Portland area of Oregon we get our fair share of rainfall running from "gully washer" to light misting, from a few minutes duration to several days of constant pouring. On the heavy rains I will occasionally check the interior and have yet to find any rain induced issues.

You did not mention where these leaks were being witnessed. I have camped in some cool areas, high 30's low 40's, and have waken to small rivulets of condensation running down from the windows as it collects on their lower sills. I just wipe things down with paper towels as the coffee is brewing and the rivulets stop immediately. Or during a rain have left a vent partially open and the spray from the rain had found its way inside.

[rumbleweed]

Based on my experience I do not believe the leaks many people are seeing are due to poor workmanship, instead they the result of abuse. To clarify, the selling feature of the TM is maximum creature comfort at minimum weight / tow effort. To accomplish this, you give up some durability ( ie cant walk on roof) but still have a very viable home away from home. Many of the leaks I have seen, especially on new TM's appear to be the result of overly aggressive washing techniques by dealers. No one wants to pick up their new TM covered with dirt so dealers thoroughly wash them. Most dealers do not have PHD's in the wash bay. In an effort to speed up washing, washers sometimes use high pressure hoses or power washers like those used to wash Big rigs. This can easily loosen the seam caulk and cause a leak. I had several leaks on my new TM immediately after delivery and chose to remove and recaulk all the roof seams at one time . This was a little extra effort, but many heavy rains later not one leak.

[kenngeri2720]

We have had our Elkmont for almost a year now and spent a lot of time this summer camping in it. When we first bought our trailer there were a few items to be fixed, but no more than you would have with a new care or home. Our local dealer (The Car Show) fixed everything that was wrong with the trailer including a modification to the frame that was discovered after the first models were built that now have a shorter tongue (trailer to hitch). We have had no water leaks even with hard rain and cold snowy nights below freezing. This is a great trailer and I did not think they could get any better than our first TM the 2720.

[mkayers]

We've only been on one week long trip so far with our new Elkmont but haven't had any leak issues either. We love it so far.

[Redhawk]

I guess I'm always a bit skeptical when someones first post is like this one with little details and no quick return to answer questions.....if it's on the level, I hope they are at the TM dealer getting issues addressed and are happy.

[Wavery]

WOW!!!! My hope is that there is a mis-understanding somewhere and the TM has not been properly apprised of the extent of the damage.

It's stories like this that makes reputable companies over-night has-beens.

Please do keep us updated. I'm certain that TM will make this right. I would be extremely disappointed if they don't.

[Scott O]

Anyone else notice that this person has made only 1 post, and has not answered or responded to any of our offers to help? I'm smelling a troll...

[Scott O]

DC Randy has made many posts and was very happy with his first TM. I don't think he's a troll. I think he has a legimate complaint about leaks in his TM.

This thread was started by curleyontop, not DC Randy. It was his first and only post and he has not responded to any of our attempts to help him. I stand by my comment... I do think that DC Randy is a valued member of this forum, but I was not referring to him. I hope he gets his problems fixed.

[B_and_D]

I also think it's kind of weird when somebody signs up, makes one really negative statement and then you never hear from them again even though we try to help. I agree with your thoughts on that.

[Dave E]

We got our Elkmont in July 09. We have seen water running down the wall below the emergency exit window. Our dealer thought the water was coming in through some holes on the top of the window and put some foam tape over the top of the window outside to cover the holes. I don't believe we have seen the problem since that fix. We'll know for sure when the spring rains come here in Colorado.

How often should we remove the old caulk and recaulk everything on the roof?

[curlyontop]

Sorry to be so late to re-post. I am not currently at liberty to discuss this, due to legal litigation. Just wanted to stop the mud everyone has been throwing my way!!!

[Wavery]

Sorry to be so late to re-post. I am not currently at liberty to discuss this, due to legal litigation. Just wanted to stop the mud everyone has been throwing my way!!!

"Everyone" and "Mud" are big words.

I doubt that there are any "Criminal" charges pending against TM so if there are legal restraints against discussing this case, that would be quite odd. This type of rhetoric seems a little fictitious.:rolleyes:

I'm not a big fan of TM's marketing techniques but your "Mud slinging" without any follow-up (other than this silly post) looks a bit fictitious also.

[Jim&Joan]

Actually, the terms of civil settlement cases commonly contain restrictions that are binding and control the level of information allowed to be made public. I am not so sure of where in the process this starts, but it seems logical that restrictions are put in place during negotiations. Otherwise, it becomes a 'barn door, horse' situation.

I do agree that the OP is presenting very troll like behavior and has lent nothing to the general knowledge of being a TM owner.

[curlyontop]

If someone will tell me what you guys would require of me to prove that I AM the owner of a 2010 Elkmont I will gladly provide the info. I just don't feel comfortable posting too much info on their site. You could always send me an e-mail to discuss privately.

[4Kids2Dogs]

You know, just because I am very happy with my TM and I think they are a great company doesn't mean I think they can make no mistakes. Even a good and reputable company is subject to human error. If someone inadvertently got a poorly manufactured unit, I would feel for them and I am sure they would be able to settle the problem with TrailManor. Elkmont is a new line. Surely there are kinks to work out. As with any vehicle purchase, there is the possibility of a lemon. As much money as a new buyer would have invested in purchase, I think they probably would be upset encountering the problems set out herein. While every vehicle purchase should be researched and entered cautiously, this doesn't mean that TrailManor Elkmont or otherwise are now on the "not to be trusted" list! Mistakes happen.
As for me, I would never want to give up my TM!

[Scott O]

curleyontop: I don't doubt that you have a TM or that you have problems. Neither is the point. To me, the purpose of a forum such as this is to give and receive information, to share opinions leading to solutions if negative, and to get information. Your original post did none of these. You posted and basically disappeared for 5 weeks. Your "litigation" notice should have been posted a long time ago, which would have explained your non-participation. Bottom line is that your original post caused a whole bunch of people to post helpful hints and otherwise try to help solve your problem. Seems that a lot of time was wasted by a number of well-meaning people.

[Al-n-Sue]

I've watched this post since the beginning with interest, since I would like someday to upgrade to an Elkmont. And like others here I love my TM and think it is well made and the preponderance of evidence says that TM does well by their customers.

But there are two things I'd like to point out.

1. This site does not "belong" to TM. It is actually "owned" by a private individual (Chris) who used to own a TM but does no more. He puts in a lot of time on the site and deserves a lot of credit as well as the volunteer moderators who keep things in order. I'm sure some TM brass frequent here, but I suspect it is to get a sense of what customers think and how they can improve their product as opposed to looking for evidence against a customer. Don't know that for sure but it would seem logical. At any rate, it is linked from the TM site simply as a nod to the Trailblazers groups who do such a magnificant job of linking TM owners together. (someone who knows the history better might clarify this).

2. Because of the issues pointed out here (and not just this post) I visited with our local dealer at an RV show recently and asked about the problems - particularly leaks. He indicated that it seemed that the problems with the Elkmont would come in bunches - a few trailers would have problems and then a number would be problem free. May be related to adding new workers to the assembly line to meet orders or some other pressure of getting units out the door. Who knows. Elkmont is reportedly making up 22% of TM sales now. I'm sure TM is doing all they can to improve quality control with this popular unit.
He did say he had worked with one particularly problematic unit that came back 3 times for a leak. He finally essentially disassembled the unit and found a problem deeper and beyond where the symptoms indicated. It was fixed and the customer was satisfied and the company was notified about the problem.

I'll be interested in seeing the end result of this dispute and hope that curlyontop will be satisfied and will then love his TM like most of the rest of us do.

Alan

[cochise]

I fully understand curlyontop's "beware". It actually runs much deeper than everyone sees. We bought aTM Elkmont 24 2010 in September 2009, and we have had a load of problems that TrailManor just waves off. The furnace was not hooked up at all, warped doors, water leaks, LP Gas leaks, screws falling out, venetian blinds flopping around too long, sloppy workmanship all around, but the worst is probably how TM treats us. "There is no problem you just don't understand" is the answer we get/got. When we found out from Suburban Manufacturing Co. (the furnace people) that the furnace was not installed correctly I confronted TM, and got an email today, that I did not understand that it had been approved by Suburban, this in spite of a warning in their [Suburban] installation manual, that no-one can authorize a deviate from the written instructions, NO ONE!!!

To those here that think TM is a great company, it probably was when Old Man Hulsey ran it. In the spring of 2009 he had a stroke or heart attack and the son Micheal Hulsey took over the reins. His interest is not customer satisfaction. And trust me I have documentation to prove it.

I know that there are others out there that have been screwed by TM, some have come forward, and some are embarrassed to do so, but the fact remains, THEY ARE THERE.

So if anyone here can help me please come forth, I will appreciate it dearly.

[curlyontop]

Finally someone comes forward in my defense. I knew we weren't the only people out there with problems from shoddy workmanship. As I said before...BEWARE THE ELKMONT!!!!

[Bill]

OK, boys, you've had your chance to vent. If either of you has anything consturctive to say, I'd like to hear it. In the meantime, I'm not sure that two non-members with a total of 6 posts between you, all of them nasty, negative, and argumentative, have earned a lot of patience, from me at least. Considering your attitude and your approach to problems, I'm not sure you can expect a lot of help from this board, or from TM for that matter.

Do you, in fact, have anything constructive to offer? If not, please refrain from further venting.

Bill

[Jim&Joan]

...which is, admittedly, not a lot...

Since they are trial members, their vent fest is going to be short lived. It might be in the general communities interest to monitor potential 'trends' in TM operating practices. Granted these guys haven't done much to substantiate the claims, but we are all smart enough to figure that out.

Given the economic times, it might be worth noting that when companies are cash flush, they are a lot more likely to throw more money at making sure everyone is happy. Often this is due to the fact the funds are coming in and this is the path of least resistance. When things tighten up, the assistance can get harder to come by. This is even more likely with a private or family business than a public one with a board demanding profit margins on investments good times or bad. (This also falls into the category of "Your true character is revealed when things are tough, not when everything is easy.")

Also, when a new product is flushed out, there is always going to be a learning curve. Isn't this Elkmont a fairly new entry into the TM world? Are these problems potentially start up oriented? Or are they past that point? Both the manufacturer and the buyer ought to understand that there will be shake out issues with new products.

[cochise]

First of all, I respect you and the forum, so please respect us too. I did not join to vent, there is not enough space here to do so. However had you been at the receiving end of TM's behavior, I am pretty certain that you would have acted as we. I am fully aware of the help I can expect from TM. - ZIPPO. But for you to say that we are argumentative is not very nice. What kind of documentation do you want from me? Because I have it, both emails, letters and pictures. My furnace installation defies belief. It violates every written and un-written code, City, County, State, Federal and also RVIA, plus it is not conforming to the installation instructions from SUBURBAN MANUFACTURING. As a matter of fact I was told by them NOT to use the furnace until it had been installed per their instructions. 2 Days ago we had a serious fire in Tucson AZ where I live. A travel Trailer burned to the ground, and the occupants are in the hospital with serious burns. What caused it? A gas leak! So this is a serious problem. Compiled with all the other problems we have had I think it is "food for thoughts".
It is also worth bearing in mind that most here if not all members are owners of TM fold-down trailers. We are talking about a brand new product (and new management) at TM. So please bear with me (us), and don't jump the gun. I have personally dealt with TM since September 26, 2009, 4 days after I paid cash for my ELKMONT, and I have been kept as a mushroom. (All darkness and a lot of Horse poop). And if that is not enough, I know of 2 dealers that are authorized Tm dealers, but will not carry the TM product, as they say "there are too many problems with them [ELKMONTS]. So if you want me too I will gladly email you pictures of some or all my problems and emails too. That way you can judge for yourself.
I joined here to see if the general membership had any suggestions to dealing with a TM trailer, don't disappoint me (us) by sweeping us under the carpet. This is something that concerns ALL of us.
If it works, here is a picture of the furnace installation in MY trailer. As can be seen it is crooked and too close to combustible material and not hooked up at all. Do you think that is right?

[Wavery]

WOW!!!! That is pretty shocking.....

What was TMs response to this picture?

[cochise]

-------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: [Fwd: Pictures and information on Suburban furnace ]
Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2010 11:07:49 -0500
From: Michael Hulsey <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
References: <[email protected]>

This is Michael Hulsey response dated 2/26 to Suburban on the furnace issue.

The furnace should have two screws into floor. Can be removed vertically with the removal of the top cover, slid sideways with the removal of the side divider, or the sofa front can be removed to slide furnace toward center of trailer.


Here are some responses to Mr. xxxxx other comments:

His complaint about the tank repositioning was referring to the dealer's attempted installation of exhaust ducting onto the air inlet opening in the bedroom area.

We have not blamed Suburban for errors in installation. We have however, had the intended installation reviewed and approved by Suburban. Any deviations from the intended installation should be addressed by a dealer and will be paid for under warranty.

Intake air is provided around other gaps as well, including through bath cabinetry and around rear corners and sides of sofa seat. We have not had any issues with furnace performance in other Elkmonts.

Exhaust piping should be centered in the outside wall of the trailer to provide 3/8" gap all around. Dealer should check this issue.


My two cents:
If you enlarge the photo, it can clearly be seen that there is no ductwork, nor is the furnace attached to the floor or otherwise, expect for the intake/exhaust to the outside. And even IF it was screwed to the floor, how would one get it out given the small area it is placed in?
Suburban has told us NOT to use the furnace as it is not installed to code or installation instructions. They are in contact with TM about this issue and we are waiting to see what happens next. Interestingly, this is not the only issue we have with the ELKMONT. I will admit that TM had a very good idea, but has managed to completely screw it up. The workmanship is so sloppy that one might think it was put together by drunk, drug addicts and a blind foreman. It should also be noted that the answer to me came not from Mr. Lytle who holds the position as Warranty Manager, but from the owner/founders son Michael Hulsey who now runs the company.
Here is a picture of a gas line that feed the furnace from under the trailer. It has a serious kink in it as it was improperly bent not using a bending tool. That is a violation of RVIA code.

[Wavery]

This whole thing is unbelievable........ those pictures are shocking. Not only is that kinked gas pipe very unprofessional but the other pipe is bent without a bender and too close to the fitting. I'd be more worried about that one than the other one. It has a bigger leaking potential. The other bent pipe is just ugly. I'd be very concerned about that gas pipe coming through the floor, next to the water tank, as well.

I sure hope that you get some relief on this and keep in touch with us. It will be interesting to the current and future members on this site to see how they resolve this.

It would certainly be in TrailManor's best interest to address this issue in a manner that could be shared with everyone that visits this site. I think that most of their prospective customers may visit this site and this type of thing should be VERY disturbing to anyone considering the purchase of an Elkmont if it is not addressed properly. Just look at how many hits this thread has......

I'll be honest with you. My wife and I are retiring in a few years and we have been very impressed with our 12-year-old TrailManor. So much so that we have been watching the Elkmont as a possible future purchase. When we move out of our apt and into our home, we will want a full, upright TT. This type of thing has me shaking in my boots........

Good luck with your resolution to this matter.

[curlyontop]

Harvey, This is exactally what my first post was intended to be, a warning. I wasn't looking for solutions or help from you guys. I was only trying to warn those of you who have shown an interest in these units of the problems we have had ourselves. I am not at liberty on post any pictures or videos at this time. If you are happy with your TrailManor, I would stick with it. As the saying goes.....

[ShrimpBurrito]

This is not the first time someone here has reported an apparently negligent, but certainly potentially life threatening, installation of a furnace.

Below is a recent thread where another member reported that the intake and exhaust ports were not even connected at all in his new 3326.

http://www.trailmanorowners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9519

Dave

[Beak12]

MY Elkmont is still on the assembly line. And will be delivered to Custom RV about 3 or 4 week before I can even see it. I'm trusting Custom RV will do a great job of making sure everything is working as it should. But I will be camping about 10 miles from the dealer so if things are not working right Matt said someone would come over and fix it. Go Custom RV.

[Bill]

Curly/Cochise -

I am not dismissing you or your problem. But I am asking you to address it like an adult, not like a child throwing a temper tantrum. And to be complete, and provide all information, not just selected excerpts.

With regard to your post, I am having trouble understanding some of it. You start off saying there is a letter to Mr. Odgaard, but I don't know what was said - I don't even know who Odgaard is. So the excerpts of the response aren't entirely meaningful to me. That makes it tough to follow your complaint.

It seems to me that Hulsey's response, as quoted by you, is pretty reasonable. He says that the dealer tried to do something about an installation - I can't quite tell what - and if it is wrong, it will be handled under warranty. I'm having trouble seeing the problem there. I'm not sure why the dealer has any part in installing the furnace, but that's a different question. Am I misunderstanding something?

Your first picture shows a top view of the furnace. It appears to be a bit skewed, and I'm not sure why, but Hulsey said if there is a problem, it will be handled under warranty. Since I don't know how the furnace is supposed to be installed, this snapshot doesn't tell me much. The kink in the gas pipe is not professional - you're right. So how did you handle that observation? Again, Hulsey offered to take care of it.

As you and others have said, the Elkmont is a new product, and so none of us here has extensive experience with it. If you had a specific question about one of the folding trailers, there would certainly be someone who could answer it. But it is quite possible that no one here knows the answer to your Elkmont questions, since none of us has lived very long with an Elkmont. If you have a specific question, such as "How is the furnace attached to the floor?", then one of our Elkmont owners may be able to answer, or provide a photo. But if your comment is simply "The furnace installation sucks!" - well, I'm not sure what you think we should do. By the way, did you use this same approach when you contacted TM Corp? Sounds like it.

I find it interesting that both of you seem to think that you need to provide this board with documentation. No one else has ever thought that. Your writing styles are also very similar. Any chance that the two of you are the same person? Regardless, you should be aware, since it was posted above, that this discussion board is not connected with TM Corp in any way, so providing us with documentation is meaningless. I'm sorry we can't help you, but we have no pull or influence with TM Corp.

So in summary, you have now made your point. You bought an Elkmont. You experienced problems. You don't think you have been treated right by the TM factory. You have initiated a lawsuit. You think other Elkmont buyers should be careful. OK, we understand all that. Is there any other point you wish to make? You haven't told us what you would like us to do, and you certainly have not asked for any help, which is largely what this board is all about. So I don't know where to go next. As I said, I don't think your approach is going to get you much sympathy here. Perhaps I'm wrong.

My grandmother used to tell me that "You attract more flies wth honey than with vinegar." That applies to a lot of situations.

Bill

[curlyontop]

Bill, Did you not see my earlier post @ 4:28p.m. EST. I was HONESTLY trying to warn folks that the ELKMONT is not all it is cracked up to be. I will admit that the layout is awesome. My ONLY intention was to save someone else the grief that my husband and I have had to endure. I am sure that the TrailManors are great units. It was input from this site and actual telephone conversations with TrailManor owners that lead to our purchase.I am sorry if you or anyone else has misunderstood the purpose of my posts. I just wouldn't want to feel guilty of not warning people to stick with what seems to be working for them. As to cochise and I being the same person. I am a female living on the East Coast and he is a male living in the Mid-West. I agree with your Grandma on the vinegar v/s honey thing. If you will notice I have been quite polite concidering what we have had to deal with. I mean no offense to you or any of the other nice people on here. curlyontop

[Tuscany Bandit]

I think that you are "Off Base" here Bill, with all respects...

These two people have legitiment gripes about the shoddy workmanship by Trailmanor.

How would you feel about spending over $20,000.00 for a trailer that has sooo many problems with it??? I for one would be irrate!!!

Stop backing up Trailmanor and smell the roses!

Trailmanor has apparently dropped the ball on this new addition to their trailer line! And it is time that the company ownes up to it or they will be in the same boat as Toyota...lost sales for both the Elkmont and the fold-ups.

Just MY thoughts...

Ps: love my 2005 2720SL...don't think I would buy a Elkmont

[Wavery]

I think that you are "Off Base" here Bill, with all respects...

These two people have legitiment gripes about the shoddy workmanship by Trailmanor.

How would you feel about spending over $20,000.00 for a trailer that has sooo many problems with it??? I for one would be irrate!!!

Stop backing up Trailmanor and smell the roses!

Trailmanor has apparently dropped the ball on this new addition to their trailer line! And it is time that the company ownes up to it or they will be in the same boat as Toyota...lost sales for both the Elkmont and the fold-ups.

Just MY thoughts...

Ps: love my 2005 2720SL...don't think I would buy a Elkmont

I completely agree Bill. It seems that you're getting a bit defensive here.....

This person or persons seem to be a lot more calm about this issue than I would be. The pictures that we have been shown of some of the furnace installations lately are very disturbing.

If I were taking delivery of a new Elkmont, I would very much appreciate the heads-up on the furnace installation, the gas plumbing issues and the water leak issues. These are things that the dealer should inspect very carefully before delivering these units.

This is not a cheap TT....... one would expect a lot more professionalism than what we have been shown here.

I'm shocked at these pictures...and I agree with the posters description of the people that did the installations.......that's all I can say.

[Bill]

Jerry and Wendy -

You're probably right, and I appreciate your input. The Elkmont has had mixed reviews, some good and some bad, and Trail Manor does not seem to have handled the introduction very well. I have no doubt that these people have experienced problems with their Elkmonts, and it is up to the factory to deal with them, just as the factory deals with problems with the folding trailers.

However, this is a polite forum, at least most of the time, and venting for the sake of venting is not usually encouraged as a problem-solving method. And comments like "kept in the dark and covered with poop" are not conducive to either problem-solving or useful discussion. And that probably goes for my comment about a child having a tantrum, too, so I apologize for that one.

So again I say, Curly and Cochise, you have made your point. You have warned us about the Elkmont, and quite forcefully. Can that be the end of the discussion?

Bill

[Wavery]

Jerry and Wendy -

You're probably right, and I appreciate your input. The Elkmont has had mixed reviews, some good and some bad, and Trail Manor does not seem to have handled the introduction very well. I have no doubt that these people have experienced problems with their Elkmonts, and it is up to the factory to deal with them, just as the factory deals with problems with the folding trailers.

However, this is a polite forum, at least most of the time, and venting for the sake of venting is not usually encouraged as a problem-solving method. And comments like "kept in the dark and covered with poop" are not conducive to either problem-solving or useful discussion. And that probably goes for my comment about a child having a tantrum, too, so I apologize for that one.

So again I say, Curly and Cochise, you have made your point. You have warned us about the Elkmont, and quite forcefully. Can that be the end of the discussion?

Bill

I would hope that it is not "the end of the discussion". I, for one, would like to hear how the issue is resolved. I would also not like to discourage others from bringing up issues about their TMs......

We can all learn from this stuff. John is taking delivery of a new Elkmont soon and I would hope that he would ask the dealer to double check these issues before he takes delivery of his new trailer. Then John can tell us of his positive experience with pride.

Why is someone a "Bad poster" when he tells of his negative experience but he's a "Good poster" when his experience is all roses. No one learns from roses....

[[email protected]]

I would hope that it is not "the end of the discussion". I, for one, would like to hear how the issue is resolved. I would also not like to discourage others from bringing up issues about their TMs......

We can all learn from this stuff. John is taking delivery of a new Elkmont soon and I would hope that he would ask the dealer to double check these issues before he takes delivery of his new trailer. Then John can tell us of his positive experience with pride.

Why is someone a "Bad poster" when he tells of his negative experience but he's a "Good poster" when his experience is all roses. No one learns from roses....

I'm afraid I agree. Both of these folks have been a lot calmer than I would have been! I probably would have driven mine to the factory and given Mr. Hulsey the what for!

[curlyontop]

Thank you Harvey. I was wondering the same thing about the pictures. All of you guys have pictures on here of you enjoying your TrailManors and I was wondering why Mr.Odgaard was being reprimanded for posting pictures of the problems he is having with his unit. I will repeat, I only wanted to save someone else from the haertache my husband and I have gone through and at the same time possibly save a life.

[Tuscany Bandit]

Wayne and Curlyontop I agree 100% with both of you.
Sorry Bill, but I disagree.
Hope to hear from more new Elkmont owners about their good and bad problems.
Just my opinion..

[cochise]

I did not mean to sound grumpy....or did I? In any case to clarify the furnace issue Bill Moderator, here is a copy of my letter to SUBURBAN (furnace):

February 20, 2010

Louie Richard
Assistant Service Manager
Airxel, Suburban Products


Dear Mr. Richard,

I am turning to you as my last resort in resolving problems with the installation of a Suburban NT-20S furnace in a brand new (purchased 9/22/2009) TrailManor Elkmont 24 Travel Trailer.

The trailer was purchased in Texas and we towed it back to Arizona.

Almost home, we spent the night in New Mexico and it was cold so we tried to fire up the furnace. The very first time we tried to turn on the heat in the trailer, the furnace started up but there was no hot air, and after a while it shut off.

Once back home I tried to find out why it would not give off heat. I had not been supplied with a manual, so we had to guess our way around. I soon found the reason for no heat: The furnace duct work was not there, it had never been hooked up. Over several months we tried to get this resolved. The dealer in Texas told us it was a small matter, and that it could be fixed in a matter of minutes. We ended up taking it to a dealer in Tucson, Freedom RV. They in turn contacted TrailManor and were told to get the problem fixed. It took them 6 hours to get it done as they had to turn the water tank 90° to accommodate a duct to the sleeping area.

Recently I was advised by Freedom RV that they had been asked by TrailManor to “undo” the job as they did not think it necessary, and would not pay for it. Several times I had asked both the dealer and TrailManor to supply me with a user manual, but I never got one. I finally found the Suburban Customer Service and was emailed a manual, based on the information in a Data Card that TM had enclosed in an information package. As it turned out it was not correct. When I spoke to you on 2/12/2010, you informed me, based on the ser. Number on the unit, that it was a different model I had, and you kindly emailed me both the installation and owner manual. From that I learned that the furnace could not have been installed correctly by TM.

Next I contacted TM’s cust. Serv, one Ed Lytle, who than emailed me the enclosed email, stating that the furnace had been installed in accordance with guide lines from Suburban, and that the return air set-up had been approved by a “representative from Suburban”, and that: “All our appliance installations are approved by the manufacturer”. (Please see the attached email from TM). I find all of their explanations very hard to believe.


Fact:
The furnace is installed perpendicular to the left side of the trailer. It is skewed about 20° to 25° to the furnace centerline, with less than marginal clearance at the front.

There is NO any way to access the furnace for maintenance, except to completely dismantle it and remove for routine maintenance.

It is NOT screwed to the floor as outlined in the installation manual. The only things holding it in place are the LP gas line and the combustion and exhaust tubes at the rear of the furnace thru the outside wall.

The return air opening consists of a ½” by 53” gap between the seat frame and the seat front. (It is likely that before the seat and the front was padded with foam and fabric there MIGHT have been a ¾” to 1” clearance. However that is not there now). And when one or two persons sit on this seat it is further depressed, decreasing the gap further. In addition to the gap there is also a 4” vent giving an additional 12 sq. Inch opening for a total of 38.5 Square inch area of return air space.

It is sitting on top of a bunch of wires.

The exhaust and supply tubes from the outside for the furnace is only 1/8” from the Styrofoam wafer between the outer and inner skin of the side wall of the trailer.

TrailManor passes the blame for the poor installation (with code violations) to Suburban by claiming that the installation was done pursuant to installation instructions by Suburban, and thus creates a potential for liability for Suburban for any mishaps in the future.

My wife and I fear using the trailer as is, because we feel that it has serious safety flaws and that we cannot reasonably maintain the furnace as prescribed in the user’s manual due to the flawed installation.

I find it hard to believe that Suburban issues strict installation instructions that MUST BE FOLLOWED by some and can be disregarded by others. Especially when one reads the following:

WARNING: Installation of this appliance must be made in accordance with the written instructions provided in this manual. No agent, representative or employee of Suburban or other person has the authority to change, modify or waive any provision of the instructions contained in this manual.

This warning seems to be contradicted in the email from Mr. Ed Lytle at TrailManor.

I have enclosed the emails to/from TrailManor and photos I have taken of the installation.

Your help in this matter is greatly appreciated thank you.

Sincerely,

name withheld.

It should also be noted that this is an issue that has been going on since September 2009, and still is far from resolved. TM keeps saying that they have gotten the OK from SUBURBAN, and they say that if ANYONE at SUBURBAN had OK'ed that, they would still be looking for work, because they would have been fired. Every time we have approached TM with questions about this and other issues, Mr. Michael Hulsey has a new answer, (not always the same for the same question). I think I stated earlier that there has been a "management" change at TM due to illness or poor health, and THAT may be the explanation as to why these problems are still around.

Suburban has told me that the installation in my trailer ($ 25000.00 + cash) is downright INSANE, those were the words used. And we were told: DO NOT USE THAT FURNACE UNTIL IT HAS BEEN INSTALLED CORRECTLY!

Happy camping to all of you.

[curlyontop]

Same here from Norcold about our refrigerator. We were told not to use the unit PERIOD!!!

[brulaz]

I think it's normal to hear about problems on Forums like this. Most people who have no problems are off enjoying their trailer or car or whatever and will not be spending much time here.

Personally, I appreciate hearing about these issues. When we pick up our Elkmont in a couple of weeks, I will be going over it carefully thanks to this forum.

[ragmopp]

And I, likewise, agree that this thread should be continued. I want to know the resolution and if others have had problems with their RV. I firmly believe that issues of this type should be documented and discussed. This forum is NOT just a forum to rave the benefits of a very expensive TM, but to discuss everything, which includes problems from the manufacturer.
I, personally, do not feel the two folks that have reported problems here should be even considered that they are the same person. That, to me, is a cheap shot (sorry Bill). Maybe, both writers could have been more diplomatic, but having these problems would upset me to no end and I am sure my language, on this 'family forum' would have me expelled immediately.

I have had no problem whatsoever with my TM, that was not rectified by the manufacturer. I can only hope that eventually these folks do get these issues straightened out to there satisfaction.

Mike Anderson

[kenngeri2720]

Cochise,
I have a question for you since you have done a lot of research of the furnace. After looking at mine I find that there is to ducting going from the furnace to a round vent at the front of the bench facing the foot of the bed. Is there suppose to be one?? There is a foil flex ducting going to the bathroom wall but I can’t see were it come out in the bathroom.

[curlyontop]

I can answer this one for Cochise---That is supposed to be there, ours wasn't hooked to the vent. If you look closely behind the left hand side of your toilet you will see where the heat comes out.

[Bill]

The discussion of problems and solutions will of course continue. We have never suppressed the airing of TM problems and solutions, whether they are solutions devised by members, or solutions by the TM company. And we have never taken a "roses only" approach to discussion of TMs and the problems we encounter. In fact, we have had any number of posts from prospective owners who express concern about becoming owners because this board seems to show that TMs have huge numbers of problems. We - many of us - have reassured these people by saying that TMs, like any other vehicle, can and do have problems, but the problems can and will be solved by calm and rational discussion with each other and with the TM Company. The first 20 or so posts in this thread reflect that philosophy, and I think it still stands.

What needs to stop is the flames, along with discussions of lawsuits, horse poop, getting screwed, and allegations of gross incompetence that have characterized much of this discussion. None of that solves, or even addresses, the issues at hand. We all want to know the outcome of these issues, but this board has never allowed itself to become a forum for flamefests as a method of solving problems.

I hope everyone is in agreement with that.

Bill

[Beak12]

[

What needs to stop is the flames, along with discussions of lawsuits, horse poop, getting screwed, and allegations of gross incompetence that have characterized much of this discussion. None of that solves, or even addresses, the issues at hand. We all want to know the outcome of these issues, but this board has never allowed itself to become a forum for flamefests as a method of solving problems.

I hope everyone is in agreement with that.

Bill[/QUOTE]

Yes Bill I'm in agreement---BUT-- sometimes you just got to Dump And where better than with folk who wll understand and give you a hand up.
John

[4Kids2Dogs]

I actually thought the mushroom comment was kinda funny...
Even though I've not had any trouble, I sure can empathize with someone who has. It's a big investment. I, too, am interested to see how it works out.

[[email protected]]

I actually thought the mushroom comment was kinda funny...
Even though I've not had any trouble, I sure can empathize with someone who has. It's a big investment. I, too, am interested to see how it works out.

I thought it was funny too. I also think it accurately described his situation.

[rumbleweed]

Been following this for a while now and understand the frustrations, but not the goal of posing threats on this site, As was mentioned earlier, TM unfortunately does not monitor this site so they will not see the comments. Still don't understand this part as I can't think of a better place to understand your market and the needs and wants of your customer.
The thing that amazes me is that TM currently enjoys a unique position in today's RV industry of maintaining prices and gaining marketshare and appears to be forgetting how it got here. If you search the forum for "ED" you will see pages of praises for his customer service. I think some of the issues are the result of trying to develop a product that is a departure from what you do best and is part of the learning curve not unlike Apple and the early iPhone. I am surprised that even with dealer involvement (their contractual representative) they felt they were not responsible. I think an appropriate next course of action would be to request a meeting with an RVIA representative at your dealer and have them take a position on the major safety complaints. I believe that would produce better results than a lawsuit or venting further here.
I think most members of the forum would prefer a slightly more robust and durable product, but understand that this is the trade off we make to have a lightweight easy towing TT that has many of the comforts larger/heavier trailers.
To leave on a high note, I guess you should be thankful you are not towing it with a Toyota Prius.

[Wavery]

I think it a bit naive to think that TM Inc does not read the posts on this forum.

I would be very disappointed if TM did not read these threads to, at the very least, see what consumers are saying about their product and at the best, make adjustments to their product through what they learn from these comments. At the time of this post, this single thread has over 4,000 hits........does anyone think that is not important to TM Inc?? I would think that might translate into several alienated prospective customers and who knows how many lost sales......

I can't imagine any manufacturer that would not find a forum like this, as an invaluable asset to their business. It is not surprising that they do not respond to any of these posts because that could have certain negative legal and ethical implications over time. However, to not use the information that could be gleaned from this forum would be a serious lack of strategic management skill IMO... I give them a lot more credit than that. I really don't think that they are stupid..... However, it may appear that they may be having some quality control and possibly communication issues.

[robertkennel]

Your only as good as your worst employee.

Calling a fact negative or positive is just an opinion, and we know about opinions.

Many companies use the terms secure and quality and they need gov bailouts to stay in business. If you don't make a good product, you won't stay in business no matter what is being portrayed in any form.

That's my opinion Robert

[cochise]

Cochise,
I have a question for you since you have done a lot of research of the furnace. After looking at mine I find that there is to ducting going from the furnace to a round vent at the front of the bench facing the foot of the bed. Is there suppose to be one?? There is a foil flex ducting going to the bathroom wall but I can’t see were it come out in the bathroom.

KennGeri2770 here are a few photos that should show you what should be there.




In the upper center of the picture, (by all the wires) there is a 4” vent facing the bedroom area. I was under the impression that it would supply heat to the sleeping area, but TM says NO that is the return air vent. (But they also claim that the crack under the long side of the seat serves as the return. GO FIGURE.


Here is the supply duct at the top coming from the furnace, and at the bottom the one to the left is blowing from the short leg of the seat, and the one to the right goes to the bathroom.


This shows the heat vent on the short leg of the seat.


And here is what the furnace looked like when we got the trailer and before the dealer here in Tucson moved the water tank and ran ducts off both sides of the furnace. TM would not pay for it so the work has been left “up in the air” sort of.

[brulaz]

Thanks for the photos.

One photo (the original installation photo) shows no supply ducting to the bathroom/bench-front, yet another photo shows ducting. Was this missing, temporarily disconnected, or not-connected (like curley-on-top's)?

If it was missing or not connected I can see why you wouldn't get much heat as the hot air would just recirculate under the seat.

With respect to paying for warranty repairs, it sounds like there was some mis-communication between the manufacturer and your repair people or yourself. It's been my experience that manufacturers will only pay for repairs that they have pre-approved.

[kenngeri2720]

Cochise,

This is very different from my 2009 Elkmont. The furnace on mine comes out through the front of the bench wall just like the other TM’s and has one flex tubing going to the bathroom. I have used the furnace in the mountains (RMNP) 20 degrees F last year with no problems other than I could use more heat in the bathroom. One thing I saw in your pictures that I don’t have, is the white plastic box marked “WARNING” what is that. I have had some problems with my Elkmont that should have been caught on a factory QA inspection, but nothing major. We are very lucky here in Colorado to have a dealer like the “Car Show Inc.” that has fixed everything that was wrong. I have depended upon my dealer to work with the factory to resolve problems this is what your dealer should be doing. Your dealer in TX took your money but did not provide you with the proper customer service, it is their job to insure you are complete satisfied with your Elkmont. With all that said I can understand your frustration that after spending all of that money you are left holding the bag. I feel it is like buying a car it is the dealers job not the manufactures to fix the problems unless it is a product recall. If it were me I would put max pressure on the TX dealer to the point that I would request that they reimburse you to take it back down to them. Let them fight with the manufacture to get their money back. Good luck and keep us informed as to your outcome we are pulling for you to be completely satisfied with your Elkmont and enjoy many many years of camping fun.

[brulaz]

One thing I saw in your pictures that I don’t have, is the white plastic box marked “WARNING” what is that.

Looks like a battery box to me. But I thought other photos (maybe of earlier models?) showed the battery to be up at the front. Maybe it's been moved around for some reason.

First thing I'll do when we pick up our Elkmont next week is take a look under the settee and see how things look there. I guess it's pretty easy to take the seats up?

[brulaz]

Same here from Norcold about our refrigerator. We were told not to use the unit PERIOD!!!

Curly, could you amplify on this a bit? I think you are the ones in litigation so there may be reasons you cannot, but I, for one, would like to know what I should be looking for regarding the refrigerator when we pick up our Elkmont next week.

[cochise]

To answer "Brulaz" first: The photo to the far right shows the furnace as installed by TM with absolutely no duct work connected. The second photo show duct work connected at the Tucson dealer after TM had approved it. They later reneged on that. The water tank adjacent to the furnace had to be turned 90 degrees and new holes drilled etc. And that was the reason we had no heat. It just sat there under the bench getting hotter and hotter but not for us.
To answer "kenngeri2770": There are 2 almost identical models of furnaces, one is the NT-20-SE and the other is NT-20-S. The difference is that the SE has the discharge thru the front panel which most likely is placed in the front of the long side of the bench. The S model is a closed unit with discharges on both sides of the unit, one should go to the short end of the bench as seen in the third picture, and than via a "T" or "Y" to the bathroom. That one terminates right behind the "throne" a few inches above floor level. flow is probably restricted due to the very close proximity to the toilet base. And the red warning label is on the battery box, warning of "sulfuric fumes that must be vented to the outside".
And yes it is very easy to lift the seat, as a matter of fact the brochure says it will sleep 4. Well that is where the 2 that don't sleep in the queen bed will sleep. It is actually only fir for smaller children, and the table has to be removed for that use.

[curlyontop]

Brulaz, Check your private message box!!!

[BOB_STRONG]

After owing 3 regular TrailManors since 1992, it's difficult for me to believe that 2 customers are getting such a run around by TrailManor. Anytime that I needed something, ED or Jimmy Davis(before Ed) always took care of my request in a very timely way. When we ordered our new units, Keith Hulsey always tried to honor our request for whatever change we wanted to the unit. They always tried to please their customer.

Maybe, I read all of the posts too quickly, but I don't hear very much involvement by the dealer or dealers where the Elkmonts were purchased. When ever I buy a big ticket item, my first stop is at the dealer level. If I don't get any satisfaction, then I look to the manufacturer. I guess from the posts, both unhappy owners went directly to TrailManor. If I am wrong, I would appreciate a reply to my unanswered question.

We plan on buying a new larger Elkmont model as soon as they are built in the Spring. From looking at the Elkmonts at the dealer and also at the Hershey RV show, we were very impressed with the quality of the unit. I checked out everything very carefully, and I thought they did a good job at the manufacturer's level.

Hoping to see a post regarding my question since we will be spending a large sum of money on a new Elkmont.

Maybe, other Elkmont owners out there will let us know about their purchases. I sure hope so!!!!

[curlyontop]

We did start at the dealership. They took somewhat small problems and made them BIG problems. If anyone would like to discuss things with me further, PLEASE send me a personal e-mail. I think I can be helpful in giving you a hint of things to check that you may not even think of. I honestly want to help. You folks seem to really LOVE your TrailManors....#1 reason we bought our Elkmont!!!:(

[cochise]

After owing 3 regular TrailManors since 1992, it's difficult for me to believe that 2 customers are getting such a run around by TrailManor. Anytime that I needed something, ED or Jimmy Davis(before Ed) always took care of my request in a very timely way. When we ordered our new units, Keith Hulsey always tried to honor our request for whatever change we wanted to the unit. They always tried to please their customer.

Maybe, I read all of the posts too quickly, but I don't hear very much involvement by the dealer or dealers where the Elkmonts were purchased. When ever I buy a big ticket item, my first stop is at the dealer level. If I don't get any satisfaction, then I look to the manufacturer. I guess from the posts, both unhappy owners went directly to TrailManor. If I am wrong, I would appreciate a reply to my unanswered question.

We plan on buying a new larger Elkmont model as soon as they are built in the Spring. From looking at the Elkmonts at the dealer and also at the Hershey RV show, we were very impressed with the quality of the unit. I checked out everything very carefully, and I thought they did a good job at the manufacturer's level.

Hoping to see a post regarding my question since we will be spending a large sum of money on a new Elkmont.

Maybe, other Elkmont owners out there will let us know about their purchases. I sure hope so!!!!

When I found out about some of my problems, (they did not appear evident at once) I immediately contacted the dealer. Here is the email I got back:

----- Original Message -----
From: Texas RV Center
To: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Cc: [email protected]
Sent: Saturday, September 26, 2009 13:02 PM
Subject: Re: VIN


We are very sorry for the oversight on the furnace duct work and we appreciate that you brought this information to our attention. Obviously, our delivery technician should have caught this problem on his final check-out. We have just begun to carry brand-new trailers (all of our previous experience has been with pre-owned), and this was definitely a learning experience for us. We are again sorry that it came at your expense, and we are taking steps to make sure that it does not happen again. You are correct at feeling that we did a poor job of prepping the unit, as did TrailManor at the factory. Our previous experiences with the TrailManor units, however, have been very positive.

The difference in the GVWR and the dry weight is as follows:

2498 approx dry weight
1250 approx load capacity
166 (20 X 8.3 lbs) fresh water
168 (40 X 4.2 lbs) propane
320 approx hitch weight

4230 lbs GVWR

Please keep us informed as we will do whatever it takes to get your furnace issue resolved. Keep in mind, also, that TrailManor has the two-year warranty on the unit. We want you to enjoy this trailer for many years to come. Thank you again for your business and for bringing this issue to our attention.

Jim Schultz
Sales/Finance

So I called them and they again told me that TM had a 2 yr warranty. Also we were about 1000 miles away from the dealer. But they have NOT been helpful in any way. With regards to units presented at shows. I am retired and have attended countless trade shows in my time. Not once have I seen a sloppy build machine or tool exhibited at a show. OF COURSE they go over a show unit with not one but several fine-tooth combs to make absolutely sure that there are no flaws. If you are selling your car privately, you wash and detail it to make it look its best, and so do dealers. But reality often times is very different. In my case the dealer told me that we could bring it back and they would fix it. Why they didn't do it right the first time is beyond me. But they insisted that I contact TM since it really was their problem. I did and the rest is history. One posted here made a excellent suggestion: Contact RVIA. And I will do that. Will it do any good? I don't know, but should we end up in court than I can at least tell the judge that I have tried just about everything, and that in it self often seals a case in favor of the complainant. So we will see where it goes.
Thanks to all for their support and advice and suggestions.

[brulaz]

Sigh.

Texas R.V. Center is where I'll be picking up my Elkmont next week. At least they admit their mistakes. Guess I'll find out next week if they have learned from them.

With your and Curley's help, I'll go over the trailer carefully. But it will be difficult if they haven't checked the trailer over properly and fixed it up. We live a long ways from Texas.

Looking at the pictures again, I think ours has a furnace more like Ken & Geri's. It also does not have the large front outside compartment like the one in the brochure. This model is clearly a "work-in-progress".

[mtnguy]

Sigh.

Texas R.V. Center is where I'll be picking up my Elkmont next week. At least they admit their mistakes. Guess I'll find out next week if they have learned from them.

With your and Curley's help, I'll go over the trailer carefully. But it will be difficult if they haven't checked the trailer over properly and fixed it up. We live a long ways from Texas.

Looking at the pictures again, I think ours has a furnace more like Ken & Geri's. It also does not have the large front outside compartment like the one in the brochure. This model is clearly a "work-in-progress".

I have been following this tread with interest. I have toured the Elkmont at an RV show, and really like the layout. Because of the excellent use we got out of our previous 2720, an Elkmont might be in our future if we decide to downsize from our 29 ft. Surveyor.

That was a very apologetic letter that Texas RV center wrote. Sounds like they are trying to do the right thing. If I were an RV dealer, I would expect things to come from the factory correctly installed, and would probably not check the hidden appliances, especially since they have had positive experiences with Trailmanor. This would not be a reason for me to not deal with Texas RV.

I am disappointed with the factory letting these 2 (or more) units slip out of the doors in this condition. On a trip to the factory in Aug. 08, I witnessed a quality control person with a clip board going over each fold down unit as it was sitting outside of the final assembly door. There seems to be a breakdown of quality control here.....both in production and in quality control......that hopefully has been corrected.

[brulaz]

Just talked to CurlyOnTop and she's given me a list of things to look for. Thanks Curly!

I also called Texas RV and Shaunna Battles tells me that they are going over these trailers carefully and assured me that all systems will be working correctly, and that they will go over each one with us to demonstrate that they work as advertised.

By the way, Shaunna at Texas RV has been great to work with.

So I've got my hopes up.

My main concern now is leakage. How can you inspect for that unless it's pouring rain ... which I guess isn't that common in Texas. My wife suggests that at our first campsite, we get out the hose and soak the thing. We might just do that.

Oh yes, the layout. That's why we bought it, that and the TrailManor reputation <sigh>. Wish us luck.

[curlyontop]

Don't mention it!!! Hope you find my input helpful. I have a few more"heads up" to give you. We are celebrating our Grand daughter's 1st birthday tomorrow (her Daddy is in Afganistan). If you want to call on Sunday please feel free to do so!!! :)

[curlyontop]

cochise, Can you post/e-mail info on Suburban heater installation and warnings. I think we have the same situation!!! Thanks in advance!!!

[voyager2]

Ok, all of the horror stories in this thread have fueled my paranoia to the point of tearing into our cold and dark 09 Elkmont to see what terrors might be lurking inside. Obviously some things have changed from 09 to 2010. In our 09, the battery box is located front streetside under the bed. Our furnace is not only screwed to the floor but is encased in a wooden frame (top and both sides) which is also firmly anchored to the floor. Our limited use of the unit due to health issues late last year revealed no issues or leaks and to date the only problems have been installing the extra frame brace (which may or may not be necessary) and the replacement of the recalled Carrier Air 5 heating unit.

Like everyone else, I am puzzled by TM's apparent lack of concern over this issue. If I were them, I would deliver a brand new unit to your door and cart the old one off to tear apart one piece at a time. I know it's no excuse but perhaps they misjudged demand and slammed units together with untrained help to keep up?

By the way, Thank You to Cochise for the great pictures and info. A picture is indeed worth a thousand words. And our sympathies to you who have had such unpleasant experiences. We will continue to watch to see how this is resolved.

[Wavery]

Just talked to CurlyOnTop and she's given me a list of things to look for. Thanks Curly!

I also called Texas RV and Shaunna Battles tells me that they are going over these trailers carefully and assured me that all systems will be working correctly, and that they will go over each one with us to demonstrate that they work as advertised.

By the way, Shaunna at Texas RV has been great to work with.

So I've got my hopes up.

My main concern now is leakage. How can you inspect for that unless it's pouring rain ... which I guess isn't that common in Texas. My wife suggests that at our first campsite, we get out the hose and soak the thing. We might just do that.

Oh yes, the layout. That's why we bought it, that and the TrailManor reputation <sigh>. Wish us luck.

brulaz,

The dealer should have no problems with hosing down your trailer at delivery, if asked. Don't be shy about asking. They should be set-up to do this. I would ask them to run the water over the trailer for at least 15 minutes.

Soaking it down at a CG might be frowned upon. They don't usually like people getting the site all soaking wet.

[curlyontop]

If the dealer agrees and does soak your unit, open your outside refer vents to see if they are wet. ours get wet inside from a gentle shower. Norcold says NO water should enter these vents!!!

[rumbleweed]

I would also ask the dealer how they wash the TM for delivery prep. It is way to easy to use a commercial big rig power washer. This get the TM nice and clean very quickly. The problem is that this loosens the caulk and cause leaks or sets you up for future leaks. Never use anything but a cleaning mitt or soft RV brush on your TM.

[rtcassel]

A high pressure hose like a power washer can lift the caulking. You never know who will get assigned to do this job and what they will think is the right thing to do.