Separate black and gray drain pipes?

[ThePair]

Notable changes on my TM, according to the dealer, is a factory installed radio/CD player, as well as separate outlets for dumping gray and black water.

Marc

[ShrimpBurrito]

as well as separate outlets for dumping gray and black water.

Why would you want to do that? Ordinarily, the gray water rinses the black water out of the hose.

Dave

[ThePair]

Why would you want to do that? Ordinarily, the gray water rinses the black water out of the hose.

Dave

I have no idea, at all. This is just how the TM came from the factory -- I didn't request it. The dealer had never seen anything like it.

If anyone has an idea, please let me know!

Marc

[ThePair]

I have no idea, at all. This is just how the TM came from the factory -- I didn't request it. The dealer had never seen anything like it.

If anyone has an idea, please let me know!

Marc

I spoke to TM directly, and was told that there are new guidelines and/or regulations for waste disposal. Appparently there are sites now that will want separation of the gray and blackwater, and accept them in different ports/drains or whatever. So, they are now separating the discharge ports for that reason, so the dump sites that require this can be certain and assured that only the one type of waste is being flushed into the proper receptacle.

Or something like that!

Marc

[mcgyver210]

I wonder if we need to separate the existing ones?

[ThePair]

Doubtful. I'd imagine you're grandfathered in, like most regulations.

[kenngeri2720]

My Elkmont came with separate drain outlets.

[Scott O]

The things our government attempts to regulate never ceases to amaze me. This one makes no sense at all. So we now have separate drains on our RVs. Does that mean that RV parks now will have to install separate drain systems at each site, which would infer separate septic systems in many areas. Or separate drains leading ultimately to separate waste processing stations. This sounds like a conspiracy by the drain hose industry to me!!! We really do need part time legislatures!

[ShrimpBurrito]

I agree. And while I could perhaps see the sense of this if black and gray water were treated differently, I don't see how that's possible. I mean, really, is the black water going to get pumped out and treated and the gray water is going to be released into a field? Highly doubtful. People dump chemicals in their gray water tank too, along with soaps, shampoos, grease, etc. And while gray water may take less processing at a treatment plant, I can't imagine that it's cost effective to have 2 different treatment channels.

Maybe Scott is right -- what's next, mandatory separate hoses for each drain to prevent contamination? (i.e. 2x the hose sales!!!)

Dave

[mcgyver210]

I thought about this & came to the same conclusion are all the camp grounds now going to have separate drains? Im so confused why this was needed in the first place.

So far every camp ground I have visited only has one connection so it looks like someone will be making money on hose or y adapters for those newer TM's.

[ThePair]

It may be a matter of (a) current Campgrounds are Grandfathered as well; (b) campgrounds themselves might be exempt; and/or (c) this may only apply to dumpstations (i.e. not at campgrounds); (d) some other nonsensical thing.

Who knows? I certainly don't :P

[Al-n-Sue]

I'm thinking that the reason is not the dumps in campgrounds, but the RV itself. I wonder if it has to do with somehow eliminating the possibility of mixing the black and gray water somehow? I agree with Shrimpburrito that it makes no sense for campgrounds to have separate dumps for black and gray water. Just my .02.

[Nature Recorder]

Al-n-Sue

That might not be far from the truth. When talking to some workmates about getting the Elkmont, one had a very interesting story to tell.
He had drain his black tank, then drained his grey flushing the pipes then proceeded to flush the black tank from the drain connection through one of those special connectors... forgetting to close the grey valve. This was his last trip of the season so it set over the winter.
After fighting the odors for 2 years he had the grey tank replaced.

[ib4classics]

So called "regular trailers" have had seperate gray and black water plumbing for decades.
John

[Joseph]

Thanks to a Marathon blow out I had to have repair parts for waste water plumbing. I asked Adam at TM to send a waster water assembly for my 2006 2720SL. What I got was enough parts to make two separate drains. One for the black and one for the gray. No adapter to join the two. Is OK with me. At least this way the gray water drain pipe will be mounted a little father back from the tire, just in case. ;)

[larsdennert]

Many areas are considering grey water approval. Sometimes called pink pipe, the grey water (in the pink pipe) is used for irrigation. It may become prevailant on new homes soon here in Cal.

[Joseph]

Well, I do not know about pink pipes or rules regarding separate drain lines...:) But being as I had never messed with any plastic waster water pipes before, ever, and TM had sent me two separate valves with no y adapter, my 2006 now has separate drains. I could at least manage that repair with out gluing my self to the TM. And it even works! :eek: Not bad for an old man who works on analyzers for a living. :D Owning this thing is like being in the Army. It teaches you to be all you can be!

[Bluegrass]

Recycling greywater is hardly a new concept. Car washes and many laundromats do it all the time as do many water intensive industries to keep their costs down. This may seem silly to those of you in areas with high rainfall but for those of us in the arid west, availability of water is and always has been a serious issue. I remember well being at a political event where Ronald Reagan (then Calif. Governor) was speaking and started to cough. Barry Goldwater was on the stand and got him a glass of water. Reagan's retort, " That's the only time any official from Arizona EVER offered free water to anyone from California." There is a huge fight going on right now over efforts to take water from a desert aquifer on the Utah Nevada border and pipe it to Las Vegas.

Recycling industrial greywater is becoming common place. There are even test projects going on to install separate greywater and blackwater drain systems in new home construction. We already have separate delivery systems in Utah communities - one is culinary, the other "pressurized irrigation" for watering lawns, gardens, etc. The water quality standards are quite different for the two.

This is the first I've heard of application in RVs or more likely RV Parks. I've never seen one that required it. Perhaps those here who have laid this off on government know more than I do and can enlighten us on specifics.

There is a good discussion of this issue in Wikipedia under "greywater."

[PopBeavers]

With proper processing, even black water can be converted into drinking water.

I'm pretty sure this is common in orbit.

[Bluegrass]

With proper processing, even black water can be converted into drinking water.

I'm pretty sure this is common in orbit.

Hey, Wayne! Can you remember the political comedian who played the piano and sang a song called "Pollution?" I just remember one line: "Whatever you have for lunch today, they'll drink tomorrow in San Jose!"

Keith (formerly from San Jose)

[PopBeavers]

Hey, Wayne! Can you remember the political comedian who played the piano and sang a song called "Pollution?" I just remember one line: "Whatever you have for lunch today, they'll drink tomorrow in San Jose!"

Keith (formerly from San Jose)

Tom Lehrer, if I spelled that correctly.

I have the CD.

As I recall the line it is:

What they flush into the bay today they drink tomorrow in San Jose.

However, a google search turns up the lyrics at:

http://www.stlyrics.com/songs/t/tomlehrer3903/pollution185499.html

[Steverino]

Having never owned a "regular" trailer, I think the combined setup that the old units have is better - mainly since the grey can do a good job of flushing out the black discharge. If you separate them, then you have to waste more fresh water to rinse out your hose - and that fresh water goes where? Into the black water drain location...

Residential grey - pink - whatever - piping systems make some sense to me, but for this purpose I think it's a bit silly...

My $0.02...:rolleyes:

Steve

[ThePair]

Well, with separate hookups, I just move the hose from black -> gray when dumping, and the gray does the same job, albeit with one extra step.

Not a big deal, I don't think. *shrugs*

[eddugo]

Ken, what supports the 1 1/2" grey water line? Is there some type of bracket screwed to the bottom of the trailer? Usually the grey water line is supported by the black 3" line.
Ed

[Redtail Cruiser]

Hey Ed,
FYI the post you asked this question on is over four years old, but as for my TM, the grey and black waste lines are tied together.

[scrubjaysnest]

Ken, what supports the 1 1/2" grey water line? Is there some type of bracket screwed to the bottom of the trailer? Usually the grey water line is supported by the black 3" line.
Ed
The gray water line is supported by a piece of wood as a spacer and plumbers strap on ours. We have separate gray and black water discharges.

[eddugo]

Thank you for your replies. I am thinking about going to a curve or compost toilet and would then want to get rid of 3" waste line and move the 1 1/2" grey line back away from possible tire blowout damage. I was concerned about holding the 1 1/2" line firmly in place. I had considered the Sealand, however i am interested in extended stays and moving the trailer to the dump station is not something I am interested in.

[Kidkraz]

Ed,

What year and version of TM do you have? On my 2619 the black drain line is mostly held in place with just the inside with 6 screws. I left my drain line in, since its never been used. I realized that I would have to cut it out and if I ever sell the trailer the new owner could reinstall the toilet. the gray water drain is secured with a clamp just past the tank main body.
I went with the Thetford 550 that sits on a low platform.

[Redtail Cruiser]

Kidkraz has a good point, Ed. You should leave your TM as original as you can. It will keep a higher resale value if you sell it and give the new owner a choice to use the Electra Magic or what ever you change it to. I mounted my Curve on a raised platform over the three inch drain as well. I put my old Thetford in a giant trash bag and put it in the basement. If I sell or upgrade my TM, I will advertise it with both toilets.

It sounds like you're a pretty handy guy, so you should consider building a protective cage around the plumbing like others here have done, instead of modifying the drains.

[scrubjaysnest]

Thank you for your replies. I am thinking about going to a curve or compost toilet and would then want to get rid of 3" waste line and move the 1 1/2" grey line back away from possible tire blowout damage. I was concerned about holding the 1 1/2" line firmly in place. I had considered the Sealand, however i am interested in extended stays and moving the trailer to the dump station is not something I am interested in.
For extended stays, which is our normal camping, we use a 15 gal tote. That way you don't have to move the TM to the dump station. For more rustic CG's a 5 gal bucket works since we don't use the Tetford for #2

[eddugo]

Ed,

What year and version of TM do you have? On my 2619 the black drain line is mostly held in place with just the inside with 6 screws. I left my drain line in, since its never been used. I realized that I would have to cut it out and if I ever sell the trailer the new owner could reinstall the toilet. the gray water drain is secured with a clamp just past the tank main body.
I went with the Thetford 550 that sits on a low platform.

I have a 2009 2720SL
I had not thought about resale. If I do that, i may use aluminum diamond plate - have it bent and cover the pipes. I really appreciate all the feedback. Tim, I do most everything so modifications are no big deal. I just made an adapter to mount a swagman bike rack on the tougue and I can still plug it into the TV as well. I had feed trouble with my Mig so my welds are sloppy - that is why no pics posted. Will have to grind off and redo when i repair the feed problem.
Ed