Tow TrailManor with Minivan?

???We own a 2003 Dodge Grand Caravan with standard 3.3L V6.   Which TrailManors may be safely towed with this car?   Does anyone have experience with this combination?

[caremd99]

I am going to assume the GC has the same towing capacity as the Odyssey (3500 lbs).  You can definitely tow a 2619 or a 2720.  If you don't pack a lot of gear then you can tow a 3023.  In any case make sure you install a large transmission cooler.

[smookie]

We've been towing with our '94 Plymouth Voyager MiniVan with the 3.3 engine and towing package from the factory with no problems. Maybe we won't head for the Rocky Mts. with it, but for us, on the east coast, it does very well. This month we will get our new Trail Manor since we've traded in our 1998 2619 on a 2003 2720SL and we still have the same tow vehicle!  

[Denny_A]

???We own a 2003 Dodge Grand Caravan with standard 3.3L V6.   Which TrailManors may be safely towed with this car?   Does anyone have experience with this combination?

Nick,

The '03 GC has:
A. For 2WD, either 3.3L or 3.8L engines --> a 3800 lb tow limit - with towing package. [2000 lb limit w/out.]
B. 4WD --> 3500 lb tow limit  - with tow package.
With A., you can tow a 2619, 2720, or 3023.

If purchasing, check the official "Trailer Weight Information" placard, which is inside the trailer, just to the right of the door, as you enter. Total the UVW and LP Gas weights to know the "theoretical" dry weight.

Say UVW = 2960 and LP = 40.  Dry weight is 3000 lbs. What TM doesn't tell us is that the battery weight is not included in the UVW because the "dealer installs" it. So add another 50 lbs for that, and our hypothetical 3023 is 3050 lbs dry. Finally, tack on another 100 lbs to reduce the surprise and dismay factor following your first ACTUAL weighing of the trailer.

*My* new rule of thumb. Read the UVW (Unloaded Vehicle Weight) and tack on 200 lbs. Err in favor of pessimism. :o

The Grand Caravan with 2WD would be the preferred configuration!

Denny_A

Nick,

The '03 GC has:
A. For 2WD, either 3.3L or 3.8L engines --> a 3800 lb tow limit - with towing package. [2000 lb limit w/out.]
B. 4WD --> 3500 lb tow limit - with tow package.
With A., you can tow a 2619, 2720, or 3023.

If purchasing, check the official "Trailer Weight Information" placard, which is inside the trailer, just to the right of the door, as you enter. Total the UVW and LP Gas weights to know the "theoretical" dry weight.

Say UVW = 2960 and LP = 40. Dry weight is 3000 lbs. What TM doesn't tell us is that the battery weight is not included in the UVW because the "dealer installs" it. So add another 50 lbs for that, and our hypothetical 3023 is 3050 lbs dry. Finally, tack on another 100 lbs to reduce the surprise and dismay factor following your first ACTUAL weighing of the trailer.

*My* new rule of thumb. Read the UVW (Unloaded Vehicle Weight) and tack on 200 lbs. Err in favor of pessimism. :o

The Grand Caravan with 2WD would be the preferred configuration!

Denny_A

What is included in a tow package?  I have a standard 2 wheel drive 3.3L.  I assume I need to add tow package equipment.

[kbrcmh]

For what it's worth, we have a 1991 Model 23 which I think is comparable to the 2720.  The first year we towed it with our 1996 Grand Caravan 3.3 engine.  We added the transmission cooler and a class III hitch.  It did fine close to home, but we had trouble going through any hilly areas through PA and TN.  We started having trouble with the transmission and parked the trailmanor for a year.  We won't tow it anymore with the Grand Caravan.  We just bought an Astro van and are going to take it out this year with that.  It has a higher towing capacity.  Mind you, there are 5 of us--2 adults and 3 good size teenagers.  So the weight inside the van itself was greater than you would have with 2 adults.  I know other people have towed there 2720's with minivans and not had much trouble, but we wish we hadn't.  Happy camping!

From the responses (which I sincerely appreciate), it looks like my 2003 Grand Caravan is not really adequate for towing.  Its 3.3L V6 and no towing package appear to preclude this.  We are considering shopping for used motor home as an alternative.  

:DThanks for all the advice!  Its much better learning all this before the fact, rather than being disappointed later.

[Windbreaker]

I understand your concerns and encourage you to do your homework on all kinds of units. Just don't forget to figure in the long term cost of 8 mpg or less, and the very rapid depreciation of motorhomes (which is greater than with cars even).  All told you might find that getting a little larger tow truck and the TM is, in the long run, the less costly.

I went down this road last year and now own a TM and new truck. Very happy. I have friends that we travel with sometimes that run a class a pusher and on very windy days they get 2 mpg while I'm still getting 12+. Just something to think about.

Thanks for all the responses.

We are also considering a tow vehicle and either a TM or older Airstream.  At least the tow vehicle could fill in as a backup car when not being used.  We are hunting a reasonably priced Surburban or pickup.  Does anyone have advice, assuming that the vehicle should be capable of towing either unit?  One feature of the TM is that we could park it in our back yard without offending the neighbors, as it is below fence height.  We're going to visit a dealer to actually see a TM prior to reaching a decision.

[Windbreaker]

How much of a truck you have to have depends on if you get the Tm or the Airstream. Airstream is hefty. I suggest a full size truck, we went with the 4 door because ours is used as a second car also. With the TM any full size truck or suv will do the job nicely. The Airstream requires you to check weights. Lots of folks like full size Vans for towing, the Ford 350 seams to do a good job. Trailer Life seems to love the Ford Expadition for heavier rigs. I like the PU over the suv because there are things we carry along with us that I don't want to ride with, like the blue boy.

A blue boy is a little tank on wheels that you dump your black water into when you don't have full hook ups.

[Steverino]

I really have appreciated all of the collected wisdom on this site & finally decided to "sign up".  We're seriously considering a TM, but need a tow vehicle first.  I've been vacillating btw. a new Sienna (3500# cap.) and a Tundra.  Sienna is more practical for daily use, but maybe on the small side for towing a 3023.  Our neighbor uses his older Sienna with a large tent trailer & has no complaints.  But, Toyota has no combined weight specs for the Sienna.  Of course, the Tundra would tow, no sweat, but isn't quite as practical for the commute (90% of the time).  So, looks to me like one pays is money & takes his chance.   ???

However, one other question comes to mind:  has anyone had experience towing a TM (or anything else) with a new Honda Pilot.  It should do fine with a 4500# limit, but what's the real-world say?

Thanks!   ;D

[Denny_A]

------------snip----------
However, one other question comes to mind:  has anyone had experience towing a TM (or anything else) with a new Honda Pilot.  It should do fine with a 4500# limit, but what's the real-world say?

Thanks!   ;D

H-Ho, Steverino,

If I could, I would trade in my 2001 Honda Odyssey for the Honda Pilot. Brochure is sitting at my elbow now. The problem w/the Odyssey AND the Sienna is (IMHO) front wheel drive, as opposed to strictly considering tow capacity. Ther are circumstances of uphill grade and traction for which FWD can be dicey, at best. The 3500 lbs. tow capacity is just too restrictive, since TM's are (consensus in this group, methinks) weighing in at a greater dry weight than the specs would indicate, even after one accounts for the mass of the optional equipment added.

The Pilot would offer a lot more confidence for me. With 4WD (or 2WD, even) and 240 HP/242 lb-ft torque, I think it is very well suited for all but the 3326 King( King can be loaded to 4900 lbs).

Another one that looks good is the Nissan Pathfinder. I believe it has a 5000 lb tow capacity, 240 HP. They're also up there in the reliability ratings (8.8 of 10?).

Denny_A

[rtcassel]

The specs in the Pilot brochure state that a 4500# boat can be towed, otherwise the limit is 3500#.

[Steverino]

Thanks for "weighing in" (pun intended  :P) on my Pilot question.

A couple of thoughts - Denny, one advantage with the new ('04) Sienna - you can get it with AWD, so traction shouldn't be an issue.  Weight, of course, still is.  I'd be curious if you feel that you're "on the edge" towing with your Odyssey.

And rtcassel correctly notes that the Pilot has different limits with boat or with trailer - I had forgotten that.  But try this on for size:  Why would a boat have a higher weight limit?  Methinks it is because a boat creates less drag with it's streamlined shape.  If I'm correct, wouldn't it follow that because a TM has a low profile, it might get some additional "grace" where the Pilot's limits are concerned?  Somebody tell me if I'm all wet...

[Denny_A]

The specs in the Pilot brochure state that a 4500# boat can be towed, otherwise the limit is 3500#.

Dadgummit - I knew that, but forgot. That's why I've been so interested in the Nissan Pathfinder! Pilot brochure indicates 4500 lbs (w/a little superscript 4) in the specs. After searching diligently we find your above quote.

Post in haste repent..............

Denny_A

[mjlaupp]

Q: Why different weight limits for boat or trailer?
And rtcassel correctly notes that the Pilot has different limits with boat or with trailer - I had forgotten that.  But try this on for size:  Why would a boat have a higher weight limit?  Methinks it is because a boat creates less drag with it's streamlined shape.  If I'm correct, wouldn't it follow that because a TM has a low profile, it might get some additional "grace" where the Pilot's limits are concerned?  Somebody tell me if I'm all wet...
A: Most boat & trailor combinations carry around 200 pound tongue weight as opposed to travel tralers with 400+ pound tongue weights.
::)

[Denny_A]

Thanks for "weighing in" (pun intended  :P) on my Pilot question.

A couple of thoughts - Denny, one advantage with the new ('04) Sienna - you can get it with AWD, so traction shouldn't be an issue.  Weight, of course, still is.  I'd be curious if you feel that you're "on the edge" towing with your Odyssey.
----------snip----------------

Simple response - YES! The Odyssey is on the edge even though I carefully control weight and religiously weigh my GCW (Gross Combined Weight) after starting out on a trip. A couple of weeks ago I was still 200 lbs over GCWR, and the trailer was 100 lb over the Ody's 3500 lb tow capacity. The dealer that services my car says it "shouldn't be any problem- going beyond the limit some". Predictably, SOME has no fixed value, nor any reference to an approved source. Therefore, it comes down to liability, insurance and resale value of the car. Too many negatives.  

As much as I like my Ody, I don't think I'll want to make that 30 day trip having to leave everything behind. I already remove a second row seat from the car and use the other in the trailer (built a base that mimics the car's mounting). So, having saved 100 lbs (no blue TM chair either), I can be very close to the limit on short trips.

I've added an AGM battery, plus about 50 lbs of floor tile and a few other light things. Very easy to have the UVW increase gradually. Nissan Pathfinder lookin' good about now!

As others have said, it's useful to have enough TOWING MARGIN so that the only concern is either the MGVW of the trailer, or the axle limitation.

HTH - Denny_A

[Bill]

Denny A wrote ... 50 pounds of floor tile ...Floor tile?  Did you pull up your carpet? Did I miss the story?  Fill us in, please!

Bill

[Dolphin4]

We recently had our TM and Honda Odyssey weighed and were dismayed to find out it was already was within 100 lbs of the TOTAL weight for both (per Honda's owners manual (8100 lbs).  And we didn't have the four of us in the van!  Even if we put some items in the van instead of the trailer, the math didn't add up.  :'(

So this weekend we made the choice to purchase a new Toyota Sequoia V8 so we don't have to worry about what things to pack in the trailer, hills to travel on or avoid, etc.  We like to live on the edge but this edge wasn't worth falling over.  

[Chris_Bauer]

The maiden voyage of the new to us 3326 was taken with a Pathfinder.   We went from McAllen, TX to Las Vegas.  The Pathfinder towed like a champ although we did stick to 65 mph and under (maximum 3500 rpms).   Granted we are like packers but we averaged 13.8 mpg and had no difficulties through high winds or even mountain ranges of 8000 ft.  At most points we were able to maintain 50 mph climbing, I guess that is good unless someone else would like to step in.  

Overall we are happy with the comfort and towability of the Pathfinder.

[Denny_A]

Denny A wrote
Floor tile?  Did you pull up your carpet? Did I miss the story?  Fill us in, please!

Bill

Just checking to see if you were paying attention.  8)

As a matter of fact, I just finished replacing the existing linoleum, in the kitchen & foyer area, to match the "Living Room". By just, I mean just 1 hour ago. I'm glad I didn't know what I was in for b4 starting - or I would not have started. Strange how most tasks worth doing aren't easy! Of course, if it were easy, everyone would be doing it!

I'll write up a seperate report after collecting some digipics and posting them. Made enough mistakes along the way, that's for sure.

Leaving for a trip to the deep south in a couple of days, so It'll have to wait a bit.

Denny_A

[Denny_A]

The maiden voyage of the new to us 3326 was taken with a Pathfinder.  
------------s_n_i_p-----------------
Overall we are happy with the comfort and towability of the Pathfinder.

Which means, of course, that I should be even happier towing a 2720SL! Thanks for the feedback.

Denny_A

[Steverino]

In case anyone is interested, I checked with Toyota to find out what the GCWR (gross combined) is for the '04 Sienna with AWD.

GCWR = 8,800, less 3,500 max. for trailer, less 4,310 for Sienna, leaves 990 pounds for people and gear.  This assumes you've outfitted the van with the factory tow package, of course.  

It may be do-able with the Sienna, but I'm still on the fence.  I know a truck or SUV will handle the towing with a wider weight margin, but the minivan offers a bit more versatility, methinks.

Hmmmm....

[Denny_A]

In case anyone is interested, I checked with Toyota to find out what the GCWR (gross combined) is for the '04 Sienna with AWD.

GCWR = 8,800, less 3,500 max. for trailer, less 4,310 for Sienna, leaves 990 pounds for people and gear.  This assumes you've outfitted the van with the factory tow package, of course.  

It may be do-able with the Sienna, but I'm still on the fence.  I know a truck or SUV will handle the towing with a wider weight margin, but the minivan offers a bit more versatility, methinks.

Hmmmm....


If I had a GCWR of 8800 lbs (vs. ODY's 8160) I would be less concerned than I am at present. If the tow vehicle had AWD also; even less concern. Sometimes I might have to haul my heavy stuff in the tow vehicle, to control the tow weight, but having the option to do so would always provide assurance that I could stay within limits. Could be a bother at times, but not a show stopper.

If I had the Sienna, towing my 2720SL, I would not be looking for a replacement tow vehicle.

Denny_A

[Steverino]

Regarding the Honda Pilot's towing ability, I checked with my dealer about the difference in maximum weights between boat trailers and all others.  He stated that the reason Honda lists a higher limit for boats is aerodynamics (boats are slipperier & have less drag).  He felt that a relatively low profile trailer (like the TM) should be no problem behind the Pilot.

FWIW...