Condensation control in spring/fall

[Kush Wood]

Last year my wife and I stayed in the TM up until late fall on Vancouver Island, BC and the temperature was a steady 12 degrees Celsius (or 53F). As a result we dealt with a lot of condensation issues and the main one that I want to bring attention to here is that our matresses ended up damp on the bottom.

We tried placing a sheet of vapor barrier underneath but that didn't help it. We also placed a layer of straw between vapor barrier sheets and the mattress with no success.

Since we are planning some spring time camping at the end of this week I wonder what my best options would be to rectify this issue. The temperature will be about the same as it was when we left off in the fall (the plus side is that we can at least anticipate eventual rising temperatures versus dropping).

We are considering trying 2" foam board insulation pieces to fit the bed area. Otherwise would skirting make a big difference here? And does anybody have skirting for their TM that they could recommend?

On the upside we have a woodstove but the downside is that we don't have the proper heat shielding yet to be able to use it. It seems difficult in this small town to find someone who can make a custom heat shield for what we need.

So in conclusion my main question is: will the 2" foam board work for the beds or is skirting necessary?

Any suggestions are appreciated..

[inghamm]

We camped on Vancouver Island December 2015 into January 2016. It got below freezing at night, and we did have condensation problems. Since then we

Used Damp Rid
Turned on the bathroom fan while showering and left it on until the bathroom is not steamy


In fall of 2016 we took a trip where we had several nights below freezing, although it would warm up during the day. We didn't have much condensation. We were connected to shore power and using electric heater(s) during the night /morning
Concerning heat - if you have shore power, consider getting a little electric heater. If not, I would think the propane heater would be much safer than a woodstove.

[Bill]

Condensation happens when moisture (humidity) builds up in the air inside the trailer. When you get the TM sealed up tight, the moisture has no place to go, and eventually it will condense on any cool (not just cold) surface. The cure is to get the moisture out of the air. Products like Damp-Rid will help. If you have shore power, a small dehumidifier is easy. If you don't, then the solution is to open a window, open the vent on the ceiling, turn on the vent fan, and get a complete air change once or twice a day. Yes, it will get cold inside, so when you have finished venting, run the furnace or electric heater to warm the place back up. But the longer you collect moisture in the air, the worse the problem will get.

Bill

[Kush Wood]

Great thanks. We used the damp-rid or particularly Driz-air I think it was called before we put the RV into storage for the winter. But since we were new to camping last fall we were unaware of this product. We'll definitely be using them this spring to ensure condensation reduction.

[LoveToCamp]

I had a Coleman air mattress plus 3" egg-crate foam in our TM. I didn't realize for a couple years that we had condensation on the top of the air mattress, and on the bottom of the foam. Once I realized this was happening, I began folding the bedding and foam forward for a few hours each morning. Not a big problem, but it kept any mold from growing.

I recently put ½" of firm-foam workshop comfort pads under the mattress, but it didn't help.

I am in Colorado, and it is normally pretty dry where we camp. I think we just generate our own humidity when we sleep, so condensation happens. I thought it was due to the bed being exposed to the outside at the bottom. But, we slept in our new TT with a bed not exposed to the outside, and we still had condensation between the air mattress and the foam.

I don't know if you can keep it from happening. I don't notice condensation in our home bed (Select Comfort with their foam pad), but maybe it does get some condensation.

Good luck!

[tentcamper]

we keep the vent open about 1/2 inch.

[ShrimpBurrito]

If you want to get a bit more technical, pick up a hygrometer. Even better, get a wireless one that measures indoor and outdoor simultaneously. They are cheap. That way you can assess at a glance if it is more humid inside than outside, which would be a good time to ventilate. There is certainly no point in ventilating when it is more humid outside.

In many regions here in the southwest US, there are huge intra-day swings in humidity. Often more humid in the morning and drying out as the day goes on, it could be in the 90%-range in the morning, and then 30-40% by afternoon.

A hygrometer would also give you an indication as to whether your ventilation methods are adequate, and when perhaps "enough is enough".

Dave

[scrubjaysnest]

We always cracked a window and vent with no problems. For the bed I got a piece of foam carpet padding placed between the bed frame and sleeping pads we used.

[Larryjb]

Related to this is storing a TM in the cold damp weather. I just opened up the TM and found mold spots where water had condensed over the last winter. It's inconvenient to monitor and replenish products like Damp-Rid throughout the winter.

I had most trouble with the wood cabinets. Moisture seems to have gotten into the foam core of the wood and caused some separation.

[Bill]

During storage, a good solution would be a dehumidifier. This assumes that you have shore power available, and that the dehumidifier has a dump hose fitting that would replace the bucket. It is certainly better than mold and delaminated wood work.

Bill

[Shane826]

When I put my TM away for the winter there is no getting in or around it until spring. Would you leave the battery disconnected to keep the converter from drying the battery in that situation?

[tentcamper]

I would disconnect the battery. I would take it out and store it where I could every few months charge it for 24 hrs.

[Larryjb]

When I put my TM away for the winter there is no getting in or around it until spring. Would you leave the battery disconnected to keep the converter from drying the battery in that situation?

I was just wondering that myself. I can run power to the TM, but I like to disconnect the battery. Would plugging in the TM to 120V with the battery disconnected work? Would it be hard on the converter? I could always run power directly to the dehumidifier.

I'm probably going to pull the trigger on the Ivation IVADM55. However, I'm thinking I probably want to run a small heater to warm the air and maintain the trailer temperature at about 10°C (55°F). Of course, now that I'm talking about a heater, I also have to consider fire safety.

EDIT: I just remembered I cannot keep the TM plugged in when it is closed up. I'll have to feed a power cord directly to the dehumidifier and heater.

[Bill]

Would you leave the battery disconnected to keep the converter from drying the battery in that situation?That's a good question, Shane. I can think of several ways to handle this.

It wouldn't be hard to snake an extension cord into the interior, and plug the humidifier directly into that cord. The TM electric system (converter, outlets, etc) would not be powered up through this cord, so you could do whatever you want with the battery.

My personal choice would be snake the cord in and power up the dehumidifier. Then leave the battery in place, but disconnect it from the TM. Connect a small smart charger to it, such as the Battery Tender Jr. or one of the small SMART chargers mentioned in this thread

http://www.trailmanorowners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=18726

Removing the battery from the TM and putting a small smart battery maintainer on it while the battery is in storage would also be a good solution. I just hate lifting that heavy battery out of the back compartment on my 2720SL.

I've never been a real fan of the approach that says "leave the battery hooked up to the converter, and plug the TM in for a couple hours each month". Just too inexact. But a lot of folks swear by it.

Hope this helps.

Bill

[Bill]

I was just wondering that myself. I can run power to the TM, but I like to disconnect the battery. Would plugging in the TM to 120V with the battery disconnected work? Would it be hard on the converter? I could always run power directly to the dehumidifier.

I'm probably going to pull the trigger on the Ivation IVADM55. However, I'm thinking I probably want to run a small heater to warm the air and maintain the trailer temperature at about 10°C (55°F). Of course, now that I'm talking about a heater, I also have to consider fire safety.

EDIT: I just remembered I cannot keep the TM plugged in when it is closed up. I'll have to feed a power cord directly to the dehumidifier and heater.Larry -

Yes, you could power up the TM with the battery disconnected. I don't think anything would be affected. The converter doesn't care - and of course you could snap off the circuit breaker that feeds it.

That IVATION dehumidifier looks nice. I would question the claim that it is more energy-efficient than a conventional dehumidifier (thermo-electric devices are notoriously inefficient), but that is no big deal. There are also much less expensive dehumidifiers, of course. Walmart has a small thermo-electric unit for $33, instead of $120.

If you store the TM in an area that is subject to freezing, you could buy a small heater as you suggest. Like you, I would be worried about fire. Or you could buy a thermal switch to simply shut off the dehumidifier when the temperature drops too low. No need to dehumidify when the temp is below freezing.

By the way, why can't you power up the TM when it is closed? It is easy to pull the power cord out before you close it. Just my thought.

Bill

[Larryjb]

...
http://www.trailmanorowners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=18726



Bill

I get the message "invalid thread- please contact administrator"

:)

[Bill]

Larry -

See those dots in the middle of the link? The forum software substitutes them for some of the real info, to make long links look nice. Then, when you click on the link, the software puts the real info back. On the other hand, if you copy the link as it appears in the post, you copy the dots, not the real information. If you then paste the copy into something (like a browser), you put in the dots because the real info isn't there. Naturally this doesn't work.

So did you click directly on the link in my post? Or did you copy and paste it?

Bill

[Larryjb]

Larry -

Yes, you could power up the TM with the battery disconnected. I don't think anything would be affected. The converter doesn't care - and of course you could snap off the circuit breaker that feeds it.

That IVATION dehumidifier looks nice. I would question the claim that it is more energy-efficient than a conventional dehumidifier (thermoelectric devices are notoriously inefficient), but that is no big deal.

If you store the TM in an area that is subject to freezing, you could buy a small heater as you suggest. Like you, I would be worried about fire. Or you could buy a thermal switch to simply shut off the dehumidifier when the temperature drops too low. No need to dehumidify when the temp is below freezing.

By the way, why can't you power up the TM when it is closed? It is easy to pull the power cord out before you close it. Just my thought.

Bill

1) You're quite right that the thermoelectric devices aren't all that efficient. But, rated in the 80 Watt range, they will use less energy than a compressor type dehumidifier as long as I'm not trying to drop the humidity below a certain amount. Using a heater may unravel all my power savings though.

Perhaps I can plug the dehumidifier to the trailer plug and pull the plug during the coldest times. Then use a separate extension cord to power the heater so I can use the heater during the 0-5°C temperatures.

2) I thought about shutting the dehumidifier off when the temperatures get below 5°C. However, that's when I'll get the most condensation. The moisture won't be in the air, as you say, but it could very well be in the form of condensation. However, if the dehumidifier was keeping the humidity low beforehand, there wouldn't be much humidity to begin with. The other thing to consider is that warming the air in the TM might help the dehumidifier remove moisture more effectively.

3) I forgot that, yes, it is possible to plug in the TM when closed. You just have to pull the plug out before closing the TM. Just remember to close the plastic cover before closing the TM. I almost lost it once!

[Larryjb]

Bill,

I'm clicking directly on it, I tried right clicking and opening in a new tab. Neither worked.

[Bill]

I'm not sure what to say. It works perfectly for me. Anybody else able/unable to click the link successfully?

Larry, when you click the link, the full link address should show in your browser's address bar. Can you confirm that the dots are NOT there? Try this abbreviated version of the link.

trailmanorowners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=18726

Note that without the www prefix, the forum software does not recognize this as a link, so it doesn't shorten it with dots. You will need to copy and paste this abbreviated version into your browser's address bar. What browser are you using?

Bill

[Larryjb]

"http://www.trailmanorowners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=18726"

There were not dots. I even tried pasting this directly into the browser (without the quotes, obviously).

[inghamm]

The link doesn't work on my phone.

[Bill]

Interesting. Have you guys had trouble with any other links? Larry, are you using a phone? This may be a question for Chris, who is an IT guy. I'm out of my depth.

Bill

[Larryjb]

I'm on my desktop.

I tried right clicking the link, clicking on properties to get the entire link, and pasting it as is in the browser.

The only thought I had is that I know my membership is due soon. However, I still have the "site sponsor" beside my name so I doubt that is the problem. Also, I'm able to post in this thread still.

[Bill]

I use Firefox, and it works fine on the link. But guess what? I fired up Internet Explorer 11 on my Windows 7 desktop, and tried both the short form and the long form of the link. Both of them returned the error message

Invalid Thread specified. If you followed a valid link, please notify the administrator

Microsoft is phasing out Internet Explorer in favor of the new Microsoft Edge browser. According to their Tech Support web page, the only version of IE still supported is Internet Explorer 11, and only when it is running on Windows 7 SP1 (but not Windows 7), Windows 8.1 Update (but not Windows 8.1 or Windows 8), and Windows 10 (backward compatible only).

Are you running one of the unholy combinations? Perhaps it is time to change browsers. I like Firefox, but obviously there are others.

Bill

[Shane826]

Link doesn’t work for me on my iPhone, either.

[Larryjb]

I'm on Windows 7 Professional, running IE 11.

I tried some earlier hyperlinks to threads within this forum and they worked. It's just this one for some reason. The only other ones that don't work are the ones removed because of spam.

I use both Firefox and IE. I run a paid VPN service that encrypts all my data to and from the remote server. Google doesn't like vpn's very much at all and I get the annoying Captch quite frequently. Strangely enough, Firefox will run my Google searches, even with the VPN running.

I found the InvisiPure HydroWave on Overstock.com. I got 15% off by signing up for spam from them. Hopefully I'll be able to unsubscribe easily in the future.

I'll try hooking up a wireless hygrometer and thermometer, run the heater which should drive up the humidity, run the dehumidifier, and watch the humidity drop. Once the humidity drops, I should be able to turn the heater off except when the temperature drops to below the dew point. The dehumidifier itself is only 100W, so if left running all the time, it's no worse than an incandescent light bulb.

To have made matters worse in the TM, however, I did find one leak. The previous owner had resealed it, but there appears to be a wood frame upon which the vent sits. One of the sides has separated and has left an open gap. If I get a clear day, I'll get up there with a hair dryer then put a dab of silicone sealant into the gap. I may have to remove the entire unit and rebuild the frame. I may also have a leak along the centre seam, as others have. I'll by getting some eternabond tape for that. I see that others have replaced the TM strip on top. I may just leave it. If it becomes unsightly, then I'll scuff it up and glue the strip back.

[inghamm]

The Link did not work on Edge for me, but did work on Chrome. Windows 10 desktop. Interesting.

[LBrown]

Before I bought our TM I researched how to keep mattresses dry while winter camping and there are many systems that can be used under the mattresses. I'm going try a Den-Dry RV and Boat Under Mattress pad from Amazon.

What have you found to work?

We're in Canada where it's not always the warmest so this will be something we'll have to contend with on a regular basis if we want to extend our camping season into the late fall & early spring.

I can't wait to see your solutions!:new_popco