TrailManor Owner's Forum  

Go Back   TrailManor Owner's Forum > TrailManor Owners Community > General TrailManor Topics
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-03-2017, 07:10 PM   #1
Philip
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 129
Default IMHO The Best Arrangement For Dry Camping

Why do my wife and I try to dry camp as much as possible. We would like to dry camp more but we generally only find acceptable dry camp sites ~70% or so of the time. We really could dry camp ~95% of the time as we rarely need electric. First for the seclusion and beauty dry camping offers over most all commercial sites. Second it is often cheaper and more readily available. Also the Trailmanor offers great accommodations in a compact area which often matches dry camping sites. This is our experience during extensive camping around the nation in National, State and Forest lands parks.

Realizing this to be our primary camping interest we set upon a mission to make dry camping as practical/comfortable as possible for long durations. After refining our arrangement over many years of experience I thought I would share my evolved system with everyone as everyone else on this forum have shared their improvements with us. My hope is that members will benefit from this sharing.

If you are not really interested in dry camping, no need to read on and be bored as this post by necessity is quite long. So here is what we did to our 2008, 2720 Trailmanor. The changes were not cheap but we did save by not having to buy a generator which we wanted to avoid.

1. Purchase some really good deep cycle marine batteries. One of the best on the market is the Lifeline AGM(Absorbed Gas Mat) design of batteries. These batteries are maintenance free and very rugged. They can be discharged very deeply without damage, quick charging and have a very low discharge rate at rest. When I disconnect them during the winter storage here in PA they are still at 12.80 volts(fully charged) when I hook them up in the spring without ever charging them during the winter. We have two GPL-4DA Lifeline 12V batteries in parallel for a little over 400 amp-hr. capacity. They fit perfectly into the original battery holder on the TM behind the propane bottles. We did place a 1/2" plywood board under them to distribute the weight over the angle iron battery case. These batteries are by far the most expensive part of the system at nearly $1200. However I will never have to buy batteries again as these will last the life of the TM. We can dry camp for about seven to nine days before having to recharge when the batteries get down to 50 or 60% discharged.

2. Install a good battery monitoring system that keeps track of the discharge percentage and battery voltage. We have a LinkLITE which works very well. Anyone who lives off the batteries for periods of time should have one of these. You just cannot know the depth of discharge with only a voltmeter.

3. Here is the key to long term dry camping with out a generator. Connect the TM batteries directly to the TV batteries using very heavy cables. I used 1/0 AWG welding wire. Be sure to get the extra flexible type which though being very heavy is still very flexible. Not cheap, ~$80 for 25 FT. but well worth it as it is easy to work with. I connected these cables to the battery on my TV(2005 Toyota 4-Runner) and ran them along the frame to the back of the 4-Runner. Use wire ties to hold them in place. Connect the other end of the cables to a heavy duty
two pole plug and mount this to the rear of the TV. My TV had a factory towing package and oddly the opposite side of the tow bar from the factory connection plug there was a plate ready to accept this new plug mounted onto an adaptor plate I made for this plug. Connect the male end of this plug directly to the TM batteries. Make sure the negative cable connects to the negative of the battery monitor which then goes to the battery negative. This will assure that the battery monitor will keep tab of amps during charging from the TV. These heavy cable connections to the TM from the TV will allow the TV alternator to charge the batteries at a very high rate whenever the batteries get low. I can charge at ~50 amps when the batteries are low(50% or more discharged) while the TV is at idle. The reason you only get approx. 10 or less amps charging with the standard connection to the TV is that the wires are way too small and the resistance is thus too great to allow a high amp flow from the TV alternator. Realize that the TV alternator only puts out approx. a max of 15 volts for charging. The voltage drop in the small wire standard plug connections is so great that you end up having a very small difference between battery voltage and the voltage from the alternator at the battery thus you have very little driving force to push amps into the battery. It is true that even with the heavy cables I have that the amps going to the battery start to cut back quite a bit as the batteries approach 80% of full charge. This is the case with most all charging systems. This wiring system allows me to charge the batteries to nearly full charge when towing for a day. I am also able to just connect up the heavy plug on the TM to the TV when dry camping and let the TV idle for and hour or two to charge up the batteries to the point that I can get another four days or so before having to do it again. No generator necessary. No noise, no fuss, no maintenance!

3. Our TM came with the optional 40 gallon tank and it comes in handy for water when dry camping. I purchased one of these bladder type water carriers to lay on the back floor of the TV with back seats set flat. It holds 40 gallons and folds into a small box when not in use. I use a small 12V shureflo pump clipped to the TV battery to pump the water out of the bladder into the TM. Works great and all it requires is time - no heavy lifting. I also purchased a large(40 gallon) waste tank tote with a handle and four good wheels that can be connected to the tow ball on the TV. I tow the waste to the dump and put the tote in the TV on return. Again; only time and no heavy lifting.

I can go on indefinitely with this system while dry camping in comfort. I hope this lengthly description helps people enjoy dry camping more while paying something back to all the people who have help me with their posts on this forum. I also hope I didn't put too many people to sleep!

Comments are always welcome as I am always looking for improvements.

Take care,

Phil
__________________
TV - 2005 Toyota 4Runner, V8, Prodigy Brake Controller, EZ WDH.

TM - 2008 2720, 15" Wheels, Two 4D Lifeline AGM Batteries, Linklite Battery Monitor, Self Adjusting Brakes.
Philip is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-03-2017, 07:22 PM   #2
bheisser
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Bay Village, Ohio
Posts: 200
Default

I am curious , how does one identify dry camping areas,,, or find them
__________________
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Bob Heisser
Bay Village ohio
2017 Silverado 1500
Anderson 3324 WDH
bheisser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-03-2017, 07:36 PM   #3
Padgett
TrailManor Master
 
Padgett's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Orlando
Posts: 2,796
Default

No solar ? I find that 200W of solar keeps my GC2 batteries charged. Do think that for your amount of dry camping I would go for 300W of Solar and stack four GC2s. Having a SL my batteries are in the rear compartment. With 20" long batteries, I'd have insufficient room for the generator.

Being a Floridian and appreciate dry comfort while sleeping so carry a 2400W (starting) generator mainly for the AC.

Oddly enough I do more dry camping at shows and such than at formal campgrounds with power so usually dry. I also use the onboard water supply just for washing and sanitation and carry a case or two of bottled for internal needs.

Suspect our packages cost about the same just feel mine is more appropriate for my needs which include a Keurig.
__________________
Looking for a 24/17 in or near Florida.
Padgett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-03-2017, 09:35 PM   #4
Kidkraz
Site Sponsor
 
Kidkraz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,037
Default

I'm not opposed to camping with or without power and hook ups, but most public campgrounds in northern CA have no power. For me it's the cheapest way to go. I like cheap and the places I visit are nice and well taken care of, so for me it suits my needs and wants.
As to that battery, its just under 21" in width, so I assume yours are not stored on the tongue as mine is. It's also a 124LBs; which is pretty heavy for the front of my camper. The front is already nose heavy; sorry for the aviation term.
I'm looking at replacing mine with an AGM type, but will look at something that will fit.
__________________
2013 2619
80 watt solar panel/swing hitch/low profile A/C.
Enduro 4445 caravan mover
2016 Dodge Ram 1500 V8 Hemi
Installed powered folding tow mirrors

Stopped playing with airplanes, now I just enjoy watching them fly by.
Kidkraz is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2017, 08:30 AM   #5
Philip
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 129
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Padgett View Post
No solar ? I find that 200W of solar keeps my GC2 batteries charged. Do think that for your amount of dry camping I would go for 300W of Solar and stack four GC2s. Having a SL my batteries are in the rear compartment. With 20" long batteries, I'd have insufficient room for the generator.

Being a Floridian and appreciate dry comfort while sleeping so carry a 2400W (starting) generator mainly for the AC.

Oddly enough I do more dry camping at shows and such than at formal campgrounds with power so usually dry. I also use the onboard water supply just for washing and sanitation and carry a case or two of bottled for internal needs.

Suspect our packages cost about the same just feel mine is more appropriate for my needs which include a Keurig.
Hello,

I have considered a solar panel as I had one on my sailboat I lived on for ten years. My problem with a solar panel is that I frequently find myself in a shaded area which destroys the efficiency of the panel. Where do you mount your panel or do you store it and move it out when at a site?

We generally avoid the really hot weather by going north in the summer and traveling south as the summer wains thus we don't need AC that often. If we get caught in a really hot spell we will look for a site with electric only which are also sometimes fairly private/attractive. I totally appreciate your need for AC in Florida. We use a small inverter to charge our electronic devices and run other small electrical items.

PS: Please look at my edited post as I originally made the mistake of saying how often I would like to dry camp in place of what I really am able to find for dry camping. The edit corrects this mistake. Sorry for misleading anyone.

Happy camping!
__________________
TV - 2005 Toyota 4Runner, V8, Prodigy Brake Controller, EZ WDH.

TM - 2008 2720, 15" Wheels, Two 4D Lifeline AGM Batteries, Linklite Battery Monitor, Self Adjusting Brakes.
Philip is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2017, 08:33 AM   #6
Padgett
TrailManor Master
 
Padgett's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Orlando
Posts: 2,796
Default

At Sam's a 220AH AGM GC2 is $180 and weighs 70 lbs. At Christmas they are usually $25 off. A wet GC2 is usually $80 and I have two of those. At 7 1/4" wide, two exactly fit the width of a rear compartment of a 2720SL.

My solar panels are on the rear compartment and shade the bed. If building another system would use three panels. Output is reduced in shade but can still be effective even at 30% (about 5A).

My highest load when generator isn't running is 12v-64A for three minutes to make coffee. Usually takes about 25 minutes for solar to restore.
__________________
Looking for a 24/17 in or near Florida.
Padgett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2017, 08:42 AM   #7
Philip
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 129
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kidkraz View Post
I'm not opposed to camping with or without power and hook ups, but most public campgrounds in northern CA have no power. For me it's the cheapest way to go. I like cheap and the places I visit are nice and well taken care of, so for me it suits my needs and wants.
As to that battery, its just under 21" in width, so I assume yours are not stored on the tongue as mine is. It's also a 124LBs; which is pretty heavy for the front of my camper. The front is already nose heavy; sorry for the aviation term.
I'm looking at replacing mine with an AGM type, but will look at something that will fit.
Hello,

My batteries are in front of the forward fixed wall that the forward shell closes down over. My model and year TM came with a steel battery case which hangs down below and just forward of the bottom edge of this wall. The top of the batteries are just below the bottom edge of this wall. This case is just behind the two propane bottles mounted just behind the nose jack. Yes the
tongue weight is increased quite a bit but the WDH takes care of this additional weight and I notice no towing problems.

PS: Please look at my edited post as I originally made the mistake of saying how often I would like to dry camp in place of what I really am able to find for dry camping. The edit corrects this mistake. Sorry for misleading anyone.

Happy camping!
__________________
TV - 2005 Toyota 4Runner, V8, Prodigy Brake Controller, EZ WDH.

TM - 2008 2720, 15" Wheels, Two 4D Lifeline AGM Batteries, Linklite Battery Monitor, Self Adjusting Brakes.
Philip is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2017, 08:57 AM   #8
Philip
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 129
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bheisser View Post
I am curious , how does one identify dry camping areas,,, or find them
Hello,

Whenever we go to a National, State or forest land park(this is 95% of our camping) we try to find a remote site which is often a dry camp site. Forest land sites are virtually all dry camp sites. There are camping books that show where Forest land sites are. As noted in my edited post we are sometimes forced to take a site with electric only which can sometimes be pleasing also.

We once spent two weeks in Yellowstone NP at a beautiful dry camp sit with our daughter and her two kids.

PS: Please look at my edited post as I originally made the mistake of saying how often I would like to dry camp in place of what I really am able to find for dry camping. The edit corrects this mistake. Sorry for misleading anyone.

Happy camping!
__________________
TV - 2005 Toyota 4Runner, V8, Prodigy Brake Controller, EZ WDH.

TM - 2008 2720, 15" Wheels, Two 4D Lifeline AGM Batteries, Linklite Battery Monitor, Self Adjusting Brakes.
Philip is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2017, 09:34 AM   #9
Lesherp
Site Sponsor
 
Lesherp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 412
Default

Thanks for the informative post Philip. If you are concerned about solar and lack of direct sun let me share my experience. When I installed my solar panel I wanted the option being able to move it around if I needed to and have it charge while on the road. You can see my solution in my pictures and albums or more details here: http://trailmanorowners.com/forum/sh...hlight=dummies.
I have now camped in numerous spots over several years that had limited direct sunlight and have only had to take the panel off the top of the TM once. We would have had to cut our stay short at Acadia if not for the option so I think it was worth the effort.
__________________
Roger and Patty
TM:2006 2720SL
TV: 2010 Tundra w/ tow pac.

Dealer Options:swing tongue, sink cabinet, awning, air conditioning, tile

Modification: 15“ tires & monitor system, WDH, Prodigy B.C., 2-6 V. batteries & clipper monitor, LED's. Additional modifications can be seen in albums.
Pictures of campsites and places we visited can be seen at https://www.flickr.com/photos/101899116@N06/sets/.


Lesherp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2017, 11:28 AM   #10
scrubjaysnest
TrailManor Master
 
scrubjaysnest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Big Bend area, Florida
Posts: 2,120
Default

Here is the link to Philip's thread that has his TV to TM charging set up.
http://www.trailmanorowners.com/foru...ad.php?t=10986

For dry camping check out Pianotuna's web site here https://freecampsites.net/
__________________
Axis 24.1 E 450 chassis, 6 spd tranny. GVWR 14500# GVCWR 22000 # GW(scales) 12400 #
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

mods: 2- 100 watt solar panels, on roof, 300 watts portable



“They who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.” Benjamin Franklin
scrubjaysnest is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Honda EU2000i generator at Camping World modhatter Boondocking and Dry Camping 31 01-22-2011 03:42 PM
Report: First time camping (French Creek State Park) camp_in_pa General TrailManor Topics 7 06-20-2006 02:53 PM
Which Honda Generator for Dry Camping? Timberline Electrical 17 05-10-2005 09:53 PM
Camping in the Intermountain West vs elsewhere in the nation... RockyMtnRay Recommended Campgrounds and Places to Visit 21 08-24-2003 03:09 PM
First time camping General TrailManor Topics 4 03-30-2003 12:55 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:42 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Copyright 2022 Trailmanor Owners Page.