What's wrong with TrailManor?

Hello, I just found this site today and it is FABULOUS! I'm sorry if I am repeating questions, but I've spent some time today trying to read what I can and this post seemed to be super informative. I was wondering if the TMs have changed over these past few years and if some of these pros/cons are different now with the new models.

Background: we have owned a pop-up for 3 years now, we are avid campers, 3 small children, and until this summer it has been great. But I have to say, I'm tired of having no room for anything, no bathroom, loud sleeping (I'm a very light sleeper so the outside noises with a pop-up make it very hard for me), I'd like a microwave/oven, and I'm liking the idea of each kid having their own sleeping space (i.e. bunk beds). I know I cannot have it all. I've been trying to research and trying to figure out what are the things I feel I need and what I can do without.

I've started to think the microwave/oven are not as important, the campfire does it all (as does the outside stove and my Coleman camping stove) and the bunk beds aren't absolutely necessary. I like the idea of having a low profile camper (we HAVE to store it on the side of our house out of the view of the neighborhood and a low profile camper is the only one that will hide) and its very windy where we live so a low camper is better.

We rarely hook up it seems, although its nice, most of the places we go to don't have hook-ups.

So, I was just wondering what the TM owners think now. The bathroom is very important, especially for going #2, I'm very tired of the nasty camp bathrooms and my kids seem to have to go all the time. A shower would be GREAT to be able to take, even just a quick rinse. A quiet sleep is nice, but having to crawl over others isn't. Plus I really want something that we don't have to make a bed each morning (need sleeping for 5). I want the kids to be able to have their spot for the whole trip without moving their sleeping bags/stuffed animals etc. each morning and then making it up again at night.

Our pop-up now is one of the biggest of its kind, the Coleman Utah, and there are many benefits to it. But really, its tiring having to take upwards of an hour to set up camp and easily over an hour to break it all down. It takes all morning the day we leave, and we can never plan to cook dinner the night we arrive b/c set-up takes so long.

Are any owners willing to jump back into this thread and start listing their pros-cons again, such as the toilet smell possibility (and along that line, I have no idea what even goes into a bathroom for a camper - how long to clean, how to clean, what the maintenance is etc.), the ease of opening/closing for a 5'3" woman, ... the other issues in this thread. Also, I have read in other posts that bugs can get inside, and the dust can get inside. We usually camp where it is often dusty and there are ALWAYS many bugs. We often drive over dirt/bumpy roads to get to our spot.

Sorry to be convoluted, just hoping to hear more opinions. I've narrowed to either a TM or Hi-Lo, but am still wondering if I would be most happy with what I already have? I'm worried about spending so much more money and finding out that what we had was best already. Any new thoughts/suggestions? Thank you so much.

[Bill]

A couple quick answers - others will chime in with more complete stories.

To my nose, the toilet doesn't stink if you follow the directions. Sometimes you can smell the chemical, but even that is not much. Some people with very sensitive noses say they can smell it - I never do, nor does my wife. You'll have to judge for yourself whether you are in the "sensitve nose" or "no nose" category. But it is nothing like, for example, a pit toilet at a NPS campground - not even close.

If you are a 5'3" woman camping without someone more heavy, then I would advise against one of the slideout models. No matter how I try to deny it, you need a certain amount of physical strength, or weight, to pull the slider out and push it back in. If you have help, of course the story is different - anything goes. The shells, of course, are easy for one person to raise and lower if they are adjusted properly.

Bugs do not get in, any more than they do in your house. In other words, if you leave the door open, they will come in. But that's it.

A bit of dust gets in if you drive dry dusty roads (in the desert, for example). But in that case, it is easily wiped up with a damp cloth.

Cleaning the bathroom is not a chore. Having a dry bathroom (in other words, a real shower enclosure, as opposed to a wet bathroom) is wonderful.

Bunkbeds? Nope. Not going to happen. But the always-made-up front bed in a 2720, for example, is a wonderful thing for kids.

Crawling over the other? Seems to me to be an overblown problem. Since I am a gentleman of a certain age, I have to get up every two hours. So I sleep on the inner side, closest to the bathroom. My wife never gets up, so she sleeps on the outer side. Works fine for us. If you are part of a couple that both have to get up, then that's a different story, I suppose, and I'm pleased that it is not mine. So ask yourself how often you get up during the night at home.

If you often camp without hookups, stay with the standard gas stovetop and oven. They always work, with no hookups, and are a blessing when it's raining and you can't grill outside or have a campfire. If you decide you would like a microwave for the times you are hooked up, then buy an inexpensive one, lightweight, 600 watts or so, from WalMart. Carry it on the dinette seat or on the floor when you travel.

Setup and teardown are much faster than an hour. My wife and I usually figure that from the moment we roll out of bed in the morning, get showered, get dressed, make breakfast, eat breakfast, wash the breakfast dishes, pack up everything we've unpacked the night before, deal with the dog and cat, disconnect the utilities, put away the hoses and cables, dump the tanks, fold down, get rid of the trash, hitch up, check the campsite, and pull out - well, that may take an hour. But we are pretty leisurely when we travel. It can be done much faster.

And setup is faster in the evening when we arrive at a campground, because I know there is a martini waiting for me when it's done. To each his own, of course.

Hope this helps.

Bill

Bill, I resonate with the martini comment...

To expand a little, we've got a big TM, the 3124. At this size, things get a little more difficult since the shells are bigger. It has a slide too. Oddly, I don't have any problem with the slide. I do have to grunt a bit to get it open but it really is just to get it started. Once it starts moving, they come up easily. I have trouble with the back latches only because we put a high density foam mattress topper (2") on the bed. If you can sleep on the stock mattress (I am evidently a princess) the latches aren't an issue either. Keep in mind that opening the shells takes two minutes and has almost nothing to do with pack up time.

Our pack up when we leave is pretty involved because I have a lot of junk and usually a couple of grandkids in tow that have to be entertained while we're trying to close up. I am the former owner of a Class C and it takes the same amount of time. I also cook mostly outside so I still have to put all the cooking stuff away. I probably spend more time reopening the thing because I forgot to put the steps up or something similarly stupid than you would closing yours if you don't make any mistakes (it's not hard- I'm over dramatizing). The one thing I do that no one has yet mentioned is that, when I close the back shell, I always take a brush with a telescopic handle and clean off the top to where the front shell will hit so the stuff doesn't get trapped in there. This takes about 5 minutes and I have no clue if it does anything except make me feel better.

The only things I hated about our TM is that the AC is so loud you can't hear yourself think if you have to turn it on and the Microwave kept jumping out of it's cubbyhole and I had to spend a lot of time figuring out a way to anchor it (you won't have that problem with the gas oven). It was brand new and I really didn't get any sympathy for TM. Lastly, I don't really like the seal system they use between shells but I'm certain that they have tried all kinds of systems and this was the one that a. worked and b. could be maintained to a degree.

The big deal with a TM that someone touched on way back in this thread is simply weight. The folks who designed this really put some thought into the problem they were trying to solve, which I believe was to design a comfortable travel trailer that didn't require a semi to tow it. My prediction is that you're going to see much of the techniques TM uses in other RV designs to improve gas mileage and, for TT, to allow them to be towed by smaller TVs. At $3/gallon and climbing, if they don't they will go by the way of the dodo bird. I do believe that the weight savings can only go so far though until you end up with a softsided pop-up again.

Hope this adds a little perspective.

Phil

Like the other posters its pretty hard to beat a TM based on its equipment and weight.

The Hi-Lo is not nearly as light, but is faster to set up. However, the basic TM is bettter equipted than the Hi-Lo. When you get to the larger Hi-Los they start to get to be very nice. Heavy, but nice.

The bathroom in the TM is better than most of the Hi-Los.

I believe that TM has gone to the new low profile AC. I had one of these on my last camper and they are much quieter so the noisy AC issue may have been resolved. For me there is no perfect camper even at several hundred thousand dollars there are disadvantages. It is more about what is important to you.

Originally Posted by tina22

Plus I really want something that we don't have to make a bed each morning (need sleeping for 5). I want the kids to be able to have their spot for the whole trip without moving their sleeping bags/stuffed animals etc. each morning and then making it up again at night.

Tina, the TM will fold down with a thin layer of sheets and blankets, but a sleeping bag might be a bit much. And you would have to remove the stuffed animals off of the bed before traveling.

The missus and I left the beds made with sheets and a thin blanket, but the comforter had to come off before folding down......and that combo still cut the overhead bed light switch on just about every trip (the light switch rubbing the blanket).......thank goodness TM has incorporated a micro switch on the bathroom wall so the light doesn't actually come on during travel.

Wow, you guys are amazing!

When I wrote about the bed and sleeping for 5, I meant that during our camping, I hate having to make up the bed to use the seat, i.e. if my kids sleep on the couch/bed, then we have to make the bed in the morning to have the couch useable. And then, where do we put her bed items? And if I have them use the dinette area to sleep on, then where do I put the table items at night? There is very little room in the pop-up for items, I'm tired of moving things around from place to place on a constant basis. I think I will move the kids back to the bed with me and forget trying to give them their own "space" for now.

We went to the Hi Lo dealer today to look and I think that option is out. We viewed a 24T and it just didn't do it for. There was nothing special about it and I think I'm happier with my pop-up then that. The Trailmanor dealer is quite far, so we will try to get down to them at some point in the near future. But if it is anything like the Hi Lo, I think I may start looking at other travel trailers and might have to deal with storage issues.

I especially did not like the bathroom. One of the reasons I'm desperate to get an rv with one, is privacy issues, well that and allowing my little kids to go by themselves in the camper rather than having to escort them each and every time they have to go to the public vault toilet. I can't stand the nasty vault toilets, and always wonder if someone is standing outside waiting for me. Just a personal issue, but I"m not a very happy public pooper! haha Anyway, I don't go #2 in the same room with my hubby, and I think the hi lo would make me feel that way!!

I will keep looking. I'm not sure if I want the TM to be perfect for me as I can't imagine spending that amount of money But either way, you people are amazing and oh so helpful!!!

Originally Posted by tina22

...sleeping for 5, I meant that during our camping, I hate having to make up the bed to use the seat, i.e. if my kids sleep on the couch/bed, then we have to make the bed in the morning to have the couch useable. And then, where do we put her bed items?...

Well if two of the youngins can sleep on the double, you are two-thirds of the way there. You will still have a couch or dinnete bed to contend with, but there is still space under the bed for dinette stuff.

...We went to the Hi Lo dealer today to look and I think that option is out. We viewed a 24T and it just didn't do it for...

While the TM and Hi-Lo are a lot alike and similar to other popups, TM beds can stay setup provided you do not put too many fluffy items on the beds. We can keep everything on the bed but the pillows. That is a heck of a lot less of a setup than the Hi-Lo.

...One of the reasons I'm desperate to get an rv with one, is privacy issues, well that and allowing my little kids to go by themselves in the camper rather than having to escort them each and every time they have to go to the public vault toilet...

There is a small difference between a Hi-Lo and TM bathroom per se at the 24T and larger level. However, you can flush the toilet forever until it is full. That means you won't be consuming the onboard water to flush. It is hugely better than popups johns and "cassette" systems.

I think you would have to go to a significantly larger trailer to get a more private bathroom.

Originally Posted by tina22
...sleeping for 5, I meant that during our camping, I hate having to make up the bed to use the seat, i.e. if my kids sleep on the couch/bed, then we have to make the bed in the morning to have the couch useable. And then, where do we put her bed items?...

I remember as a kid spending vacations at grandparents mountain cabin. They had a large open dorm style bedroom upstairs with 6 double/queen beds. Until we were 10 or so, us kids could sleep 4-5 to a bed sleeping crosswise. Not knowing how old/big your kids are, maybe this could be an option.

[mbd4kids]

We just returned from our first real vacation with our new to us 3023 (23 feet long closed, 30 open). It has a double bed in front, queen in back, and 2 sofas (one opens to a double). There are 6 of us, including 2 larger, but not huge teenagers, a 13 year old and a 10 year old. I will assure you that this trailer worked quite well (maybe not as well as our old full size, but we wanted the low profile this go round). Everyone had a bed, and if I shared the double sofa with our daughter, we even had a sofa to sit on and drink our coffee. Storage for clothes was good, as was dry food storage. We loved the ledges for cell phones and other teenage necessities. Biggest complaint was the smaller fridge, but tolerable, and I thought the toilet was stinky. We did not use it for #2, and it still was bad, but we did not use chemicals with formaldehide, which I have since read are a bit of a necessity. It is also an older trailer (10 years), so may have issues with seals, which we will deal with after we try other chemicals. I looked at many pop ups before buying this one, and I assure you the storage is wonderful, and makes life much happier. We just threw the sofa linens on the bed in the day (neatly) and kept shoes outside (for dirt, and space reasons). Good Luck!