This season's lessons

I don;t have a Elkmont and have not done detailed research on this tire, but I can't imagine running a trailer tire at 25 PSI. Check the load range and run near the mid to upper end of the pressure range.

[rickst29]

Originally Posted by voyager2

I weighed my Elkmont at the public scale and the trailer axle weight set to tow with WDH hooked up, read 2680 (we tow dry and lite). Per the Goodyear website, inflation info., I should be inflating trailer tires to no more than 25 PSI. I have been towing at 65 PSI, per TM. Both possibilities make me very nervous. Any suggestions?

These vendor-provided inflation tables, e.g. Goodyear, show the MAXIMUM load which the tire can handle at the given PSI. At 25 PSI, you have only 100-200 pounds of headroom left on the tire loading. IMO, That's too close to the limit for the tire with less air in it.

Your confusion is my fault; I didn't explain it well. In my previous post, I said that "It's a bad idea to inflate to more than about 10 PSI above the listed pressure (cold PSI) for the load which you're putting on the tire". But I should have also emphasized that you DO want to add those 10 lbs!

Step 1: find the number which is closest too, but above, the load which you will be carrying on each tire.

Step 2: read the corresponding PSI from the header of the column. This creates a fully loaded tire.

Step 3: add about 8-10 PSI to that number, avoiding a fully-loaded configuration.

Step 4: Adjust for roadways and speed. If you intend to travel at more than 65 MPH on smooth roads (e.g. freeways), add 10 PSI more. (This reduces tire squirm at the leading edge of the tire, and because the roads are pretty smooth, you don't need a lot of flexibility for handling potholes.) Conversely, if you're driving on badly rutted dirt roads full of giant rocks and potholes, add NOTHING above the figure from Step 3.

Step 5: Have a great trip!

[rickst29]

Originally Posted by brulaz

You do tow light.
Our Elkmont axle weight weighed in at 3240# (including the WDH's 200#).
But I wonder about your scale. The manufacturer's listed dry weight for our trailer is 2940#, but that includes all options? Maybe you have zero options?

The torque which is created by a cinched-up WDH pushes some of the tongue weight back to the Trailer axle, but most of it is still carried by the TV. The purpose of a WDH is put more weight on the TV front axle, take some off the TV rear axle -- so that the two axles are properly balanced, and the TV squats by the same amount at all tire positions.)

So his dry weight on the axle, with WDH, could easily be less than total weight of the Trailer. If his scale measurement is correct, then recommendation for Voyager2 is 35-40 PSI for "slow" travel on damaged roadways, 40-45 for "really fast" travel on Freeways/Interstate highways. Even with the extra pressure, I wouldn't go more than don't go more than 75 MPH. (Only where it's legal; of course -- NOT in California!)

Bruce, your own choice of PSI seems absolutely perfect.

Just to confuse matters further, Goodyear has a Product Service Bulletin out #2006-06 which says: "Trailers tires should be operated at inflation pressures that are specified by the trailer manufacturer." Which Trailmanor says is 65psi.

But I ignore this, as I think Goodyear knows more about tires than Trailmanor, and probably GoodYear is just trying to cover itself legally with that statement.

[rickst29]

Originally Posted by rumbleweed

I don;t have a Elkmont and have not done detailed research on this tire, but I can't imagine running a trailer tire at 25 PSI. Check the load range and run near the mid to upper end of the pressure range.

Bob, what's your typical loading, and what PSI do you use?

Originally Posted by rickst29

So his dry weight on the axle, with WDH, could easily be less than total weight of the Trailer.

You are right. Axle weight really has to be a lot less than GVW. I shouldn't have compared it to our trailer's dry GVW.

But I would still like to know how his axle weight is 560# less than mine?
My WDH puts 200# back on the axle, maybe his does less?
Maybe he has fewer options? I have maybe 80# of extra batteries, but still, it seems like a big difference.

I weighed at a public truck stop scale two times. With WDH engaged, steer axle on 2010 Tundra was 3200 and without it was 3020. Drive axle was 3360and 3640 and trailer axle was 2680 and 2600. We did have full propane tanks and 2x T105's and awning. No other liquid on board. Have AC, Thetford recirc. toilet, awning. Fridge empty but cupboard loaded. Total gross weight of rig was 9240, minus passengers. Do I need to reweigh on a different scale?

I am getting from the comments above that I should be ok at 45-50 PSI?

This thread has taken on a bit of life today while I was driving our new tow vehicle back from the dealer in Texas. Anne's answered the "where were we" question; I think a shorter camper (2720) might have fit the spot more easily if the leveling jacks are closer together. Our main reason for being disgusted with our laziness not to recon the site is how nice 2 of the 4 sites were; not that we had to work to level the camper. I did notice that putting the Expedition into 4wd helped push it up the hill on the gravel without wheel-spin.

I think that two additional things we are pondering this season is a better way to get the refrig cooled down initially along with getting the plumbing fittings to fill the tank from the drain valve without popping up the camper. The plumbing fittings look really easy other than I'd like to re-route the drain so that when the tank is full it doesn't soak the upper shell and curtain. For the refrig, we are currently using a system of coolers with ice blocks for the first day or two until the refrig cools down, but adding a switch to the exterior to turn on the fan and the refrig (on 12V) while in the garage for a day or two might be better if we can work out the details.

As for the tires, I don't have good answers for a lot of the questions. They were original tires with original cheap rubber stems, so that's always possible. I actually recall reading everyone's suggestion for metal valve stems now, but I was too frazzled at the time to remember. If I decide to get them re-mounted with metal stems, I'll just take the wheels into the dealer myself and not risk trying to keep them from jacking on the axle. I would be tempted to say it's too coincidental that Marathons are the tires getting the flats, but then Marathons are the OEM tires so they are the only tires with a reasonable sample size.

While it's possible also that we typically over-inflate the tires, I don't think that specifically affects tire life; under-inflation is typically blamed as a possible cause for shortening tire life. We do load things pretty heavy (AC, solar, twin 6V batteries in the rear exterior storage and awnings are permanent options, and we often add the Yamaha and a bunch of firewood into the rear exterior storage, which has a bit of leverage onto the trailer axle) but I've never had the axle weighed, and I should.

I will say that at low city speeds I was un-aware that I had a flat until the guy in the pickup told me, so I had shredded any of the evidence of the tire's demise by then. One advantage of a wireless tire monitor might be that at highway speeds you will avoid further damage to the camper if you can pull over quickly enough, even if you can't avoid the actual flat tire.

Originally Posted by voyager2

I weighed at a public truck stop scale two times. With WDH engaged, steer axle on 2010 Tundra was 3200 and without it was 3020. Drive axle was 3360and 3640 and trailer axle was 2680 and 2600. We did have full propane tanks and 2x T105's and awning. No other liquid on board. Have AC, Thetford recirc. toilet, awning. Fridge empty but cupboard loaded. Total gross weight of rig was 9240, minus passengers. Do I need to reweigh on a different scale?

I am getting from the comments above that I should be ok at 45-50 PSI?

I would say 45-50psi would be fine for all speeds.

Some of our weight difference is the WDH, my setup throws back 200# to the trailer axle, not 80#. And we don't have the recirc. toilet, but other options are similar. A puzzle. I'll be reweighing mine at a different CAT scale in a couple of weeks, but we'll be loaded quite differently (moving the daughter cross-country). We'll see.

Just out of curiosity, what is Trailmanor's listed dry weight for your trailer? Ours is 2940#

And Mark, I apologize too for hi-jacking your thread. We're moving our Elkmont weight discussion to: http://www.trailmanorowners.com/foru...ad.php?t=10654

[cochise]

Originally Posted by voyager2

I am not trying to steal this thread but Rikst29's post above raises serious questions in my mind about my current towing practices. So, Moderator, if I am stepping on toes here, please feel free to move or delete.

I weighed my Elkmont at the public scale and the trailer axle weight set to tow with WDH hooked up, read 2680 (we tow dry and lite). Per the Goodyear website, inflation info., I should be inflating trailer tires to no more than 25 PSI. I have been towing at 65 PSI, per TM. Both possibilities make me very nervous. Any suggestions? I am seriously looking for help here as we are scheduled to leave on a 2500 mile trip next week. Thanks.

I too had some doubt about tire pressure, so I emailed Goodyear, and here is their answer:
From: [email protected] on 08/06/2010 11:48 AM

Sent by: Goodyear Tire & Rubber Company Consumer Relations 728 1144 East
Market Street Akron, OH 44316 Voice #: 800.321.2136 Fax #:
330.796.6829

Thank you for contacting our website.

Goodyear recommends that you stay with the max pressure of 65PSI,
especially when traveling.
If you have any further questions please call our customer service office
at 800-321-2136.

Regards,
Teresa G
Consumer Relations

So I am pumping my tires to the recommended 65PSI, AND I am taking it to a tire store to have the valves replaced with steel stems.