Drain Valve Lubrication

[ShrimpBurrito]

Originally Posted by Goodyear Travels

I'm inclined to use the Dow Corning product or something like it -- when I put it all back together tomorrow.

I'm sure open to advice. I'd prefer not to go through this again for a long, long time. Eric

Eric,

All I can say is that I've been down the same exact road as you before in regard to the torn seal, and the Dow 111 lube has done the trick for me. Haven't had any problems since, and it's been 12-18 months or so. I don't add anything other than water and Thetford Aqua-Kem when charging the toilet.

Incidentally, Thetford did make an EZ-Slide valve with a stainless blade, and I'm nearly certain it was for the Electra-Magic. I'm not sure why they changed, or if it was for some specific installation or what, but obviously that is no longer the case.

Dave

Now I'm conflicted, Dave. There are two little figures --- each whispering into one of my ears, "Just put it back together with the plastic blade -- it'll be fine", and the other whispers, "Change it to stainless --- or you'll be sorry".

Anyone gotta a crystal ball?

If plastic (which would be less expensive) worked fine for Thetford, --- then why change to stainless?

[Wavery]

Originally Posted by Goodyear Travels

Now I'm conflicted, Dave. There are two little figures --- each whispering into one of my ears, "Just put it back together with the plastic blade -- it'll be fine", and the other whispers, "Change it to stainless --- or you'll be sorry".

Anyone gotta a crystal ball?

If plastic (which would be less expensive) worked fine for Thetford, --- then why change to stainless?

It appears to me that gate itself is Teflon (not plastic). IMHO S/S would not be a good medium for that gate and I doubt the gate itself is the issue in the 1st place. Stainless steel is just that "stainLESS". S/S does corrode, gall and pit when left in moisture and certain chemicals. S/S will also flex and distort with different temperatures. Teflon, on the other hand, does none of that and is self-lubricating. IMHO Teflon is a far superior medium to any metal that would constantly need servicing.

Teflon is commonly used in gate valves for under water through-hull valves on boats (in sea-water). They need no lubrication and last for years. The only maintenance that they require is to open and close the valve a few times a year. You will never find one made of S/S. The expensive ones are made of bronze (that's what I had on my yacht) and must be disassembled yearly and lubricated.

The picture that Eric shows seems to indicate that something got lodged between the gate and the slide. It is very common for assemblies, like these toilets, to have debris inside (i.e. plastic or metal shavings) from the manufacturer of the toilet or trailer.. I would think that the culprit is far more likely to be far gone and the likelihood of further issues unlikely.

[cochise]

Originally Posted by brulaz

So how do you lubricate the drain valves (grey and black tanks)?
My tanks are clean, so now would be a good time to do it, and the slide valves seem to be getting stiffer.

Just clean the sliders with q-tips and add petroleum jelly?
Or is there a special grease?
Or do you tear apart the drain valve first?

Or doesn't Thetford have something that you just pour in the tank? How does that work?

Thanks in advance for any advice.

I forgot to mention that perhaps it is not the valve itself that is tight. The handle is connected to the sliding valve with a long stem that slides in a rubber (or something like that) grommet. Try spraying some silicone on that, or spear a glob of plumbers silicone grease on that stem. It made mine slide much easier.

[ShrimpBurrito]

Originally Posted by Goodyear Travels

Now I'm conflicted, Dave. There are two little figures --- each whispering into one of my ears, "Just put it back together with the plastic blade -- it'll be fine", and the other whispers, "Change it to stainless --- or you'll be sorry".

If plastic (which would be less expensive) worked fine for Thetford, --- then why change to stainless?

I don't think a stainless blade is even an option for you, since I don't think they make it anymore. But in my experience, even it were an option, it's not worth doing anyway because the Dow 111 lube fixes the issue. Or it does at least so far.

A seal tear like what you have is a common problem with these toilets, at least as reported here on the forum. Anytime someone reports the toilet not having the "whoosh" when dumping has the issue, and that is because the seal is leaking because the gate cannot fully close. When closing the valve, the gate hits the tear, deforms the seal such that part of it is now above and below the gate, and the seal then prevents the gate from moving forward further. When it first happened to me, I didn't realize what the problem was. At first, the gate handle becomes more difficult to operate, especially the last little bit when you close it. Then eventually the valve leaks.

Clearly some folks here don't need to lube their valve. That may be because their valve really doesn't need it, or maybe because they don't realize they have a problem. But since you clearly have the problem, and you already have the thing torn apart, it would seem foolish to me not to lube the valve.

If I were you, I'd replace all the seals in that valve (Thetford sells a kit), generously lube it with Dow 111, and then stop thinking about the toilet. It's bad for you.

Dave

You guys are Great ! I feel better much better about my "teflon" gate & I'm going to slap it back to together (maybe with a smig of lube for luck) and be done with it.

As you may have guessed -- I'm probably one of few people in this world -- who could lose sleep -- deliberating about a toilet.

Thanks again Gang. Eric

Originally Posted by Goodyear Travels

As you may have guessed -- I'm probably one of few people in this world -- who could lose sleep -- deliberating about a toilet.

Nah. You're in good company. This board is jam packed with lengthy dissertations on the Thetford Recirculating Toilet.

Thank goodness, we don't have the recirculating Thetford.

And, Cochise, I think you're right. It's probably the shaft that's sticking. That's the only part exposed to > 10K miles grime.

[ShrimpBurrito]

I am sure I rank at the top of the list of people who spend time thinking about the toilet. Hence, my advice. It's just not healthy, but I can't help myself.

Dave

Originally Posted by brulaz

Nah. You're in good company. This board is jam packed with lengthy dissertations on the Thetford Recirculating Toilet.

Thank goodness, we don't have the recirculating Thetford.

And, Cochise, I think you're right. It's probably the shaft that's sticking. That's the only part exposed to > 10K miles grime.

When boondocking, the only alternative to a recirculating toilet is an large quantity of blue totes, and room to haul them when they are full.

I have recommended the Dow Corning silicone lubricant here before.
A re-cap, In the 1980's and 90's I owned a swimming pool equipment repair business in Calif. (equipment repair only, residential and commercial), during those years I attended many classes by manufactures and master plumbers.
I used the product, per manufactures recommendations on multi-port valves, 1 1/2 and
2" pvc. These valves change the direction of water flow from pool,spa,waterfall etc.. They have manual and automated valves.
The chlorinated water is flowing at 40 to 120 GPM depending on the system.
The valve manufactures recommend Dow Coring 111 once a year or so to prevent binding. The newer valves even have "zert" fittings to accomplish this but in those days we had to take them apart and do it manually.
Failure to lubricate would produce a frozen valve that would take a puller, similar to a steering wheel puller to get them apart, often damaged beyond repair.
They had a similar but heavier nylon gasket surrounding 2,3,or 4 ports, we have one port on our rv's.
Our current dump valves are cheaply manufactured compared to those valves which is why we experience the problems we do.
When I have to replace a dump valve, I will disassembel the new valve and use the 111 from the start.
There is no reason an old valve cannot be disassembled and use the 111, but I would replace the gasket at the same time.
The Dow Corning product is so good, given our typical use in the rv that the lubricant should last for years.
Sorry for the long post but this product is a real problem solver, though not cheap.
John