TrailManor refrigerator concern

Looking at 3023 TrailManor - and I'm impressed. However, wife says that the refrig is "inadequate." She says it won't hold enough and to load or unload you have to kneel on the floor. How do you owners out there contend with the small refrig at floor level. Is it a problem?

She won't let me look any further until I have an answer to her refrig concern.

Thanks for your help!

[camperboy]

The refrig in our TM (3023) has proven to be large enough to hold food for two of us during a 3 week trip. Stopped for food every 5-7 days, depending where we were. We were able to freeze some meat in the freezer portion. For us it works fine. Loading/unloading hasn't been a problem for us. If we are going to be away from food stores for longer we will use a cooler in addition to the TM refer.

Camperboy

[Bill]

When we were in northern California last June, my wife caught a 25-pound Chinook salmon in the Klamath River. After the excitement passed, and we cut and wrapped all the salmon, we found that we needed A LOT of refrig space, and the TM refrig alone wasn't going to do it. Fortunately, we had a 40-quart Coleman thermoelectric cooler ($79 at Wal-Mart including an AC power adapter). We put most of the day-to-day food in the Coleman, and stuffed all the salmon in the TM refrig. We found that if we turned the TM refrig to max, the whole thing became a freezer. What a great thing! We loaded the salmon in, and all the other frozen foods, too, and used it as our freezer, while the Coleman served as our refrigerator.

Since then, whenever we are out for several days, we use the Coleman for most day-to-day stuff, and load the TM refrig with the overflow or things we don't need very often - frozen or not, as the need dictates. The Coleman travels on the floor, and when we reach a campsite and set up, I lift it onto a countertop. This has been a great solution, nearly doubling our refrig capacity, and eliminating a lot of the bending.

Bill

[tipper]

What you see is what you get.  The refer is small compared to conventional RVs and if mama ain't happy ain't nobody happy.  

If you're coming from tent camping the refer is really appreciated.  But some of the TM advantages do come with compromises.

The thermoelectric powered cooler is good if you can afford the space for it and have AC power available.

[BOB_STRONG]

POSSIBLE 3023 TM OWNER

In April of this year, we left our home in northern Pa  and left for Fort Wilderness in Orlando Florida. We were on the road 2 days, and we stayed there from Monday thru Friday. We fixed a lot of meals at home, and then stored the meals in bowls in the refrig. We ate out one night during the week, and at this time we replenished some food for the return trip home on Friday. We also have a Coleman cooler to store other items in. Taking things out and putting them back is no problem. In this day and age, it's not like you can't find a store easy enough. If you are a bargain hunter when it comes to shopping, most stores run sales every week.

After all, you are out camping. Who needs to take their side by side refrig along with them. As our old Coleman camper brochure said," KEEP IT SIMPLE AND HAVE FUN!"

The refrig may look small, but if you know how to pack things, you will be surprised at  what you can pack in there!! All you need is the right size bowls and containers for the food to pack in there.

Most people forget that you sure can get a lot of things in the door. We put milk, juice, and a bottle of water on the lower shelf. The other two are used for soda and butter and other small items.

Having owned 3 Trailmanors since 1992, we CANNOT find any problems with the low refrig! :) :)

BOB STRONG

we plan to take a 1st trip of 2003 is at Yosemite National park in April. we have some concerns about park rules about storage of foods. can we just leave our foods in refrigator instead in "metal bin" of camp site?..anybody have any experienced about this situation?any advises?  

[oilspot]

A year ago my wife an I started looking at something bigger and more secure than our Starcraft pop-up.

We found a nice full size 25' Palamino trailer that was exactly what we wanted.  The cost was slightly less than a new TM, but the weight was considerably more...

What sticks out in my mind was the nearly full size fridge and freezer.  We were really excited about the full use of space above the counters (such as wall cabinets, big fridge, range hood, etc.).

Unfortunately in the end, I decided my tow vehicle would quickly wear out from the strain of pulling such a big trailer.

I don't regret buying the TM, because it tows like no other trailer on the market.  The compact size when closed and the generous space when open is what sold us on the TM.  The big compromise was the lack of any permanent fixtures on the upper halves, which means a slightly smaller fridge.

However when we are camping, we rarely have any problems with refrigerator capacity.  We've been very happy with the layout and function of the trailer.

[Bill]

2619er -

Last June, we stayed about 5 days in Sequoia/King's Canyon NP, and then about 5 days in Yosemite NP. In Sequoia, they were VERY serious about bears and bear boxes. The rangers gave us the bear-box speech as we checked in, also gave us a pamphlet, and then came by later to remind us. They insisted that not only food, but also soap, hair spray, deodorant, and anything with a smell, should go into the bear box at night. And beyond this, they asked us to throw a blanket over anything rectangular in the car. Apparently, the bears peek in the car window and think that a rectangular box is a cooler (even if it is really a cardboard box of books), and rip open the car to get it. We heeded the warnings and had no problems, but there were three bear break-ins in our campground (about 300 sites) during our 5-day stay. I presume that these involved people who didn't pay attention to the warnings. There were no injuries - the bears want food and are basically afraid of people. For what it is worth, about 200 of the 300 sites were occupied by canvas pop-ups or tents, but we were glad to be in a hard-sided TM. So yes, I would take the bear-boxes seriously.

By contrast, Yosemite also had bear boxes, but the rangers didn't mention them and few people seemed to use them. We did, having just come from Sequoia, but we didn't hear about any bear problems.

If you are going to use a bear box, the thermoelectric cooler is really handy. At the end of the day, you put all your pre-chilled perishables into the T-E cooler, and slide it into the bear box. In the morning, you pull the cooler out of the bear box and simply plug it in - no need to transfer the food back and forth to the TM refrig. Incidentally, the basic T-E cooler uses 12 VDC. You don't need AC power to run it, as was suggested in an earlier post. This is a good thing, since none of the sites in Sequoia or Yosemite had AC power available. IF you have AC power, and IF you have an AC adapter (comes with the Coleman), THEN you can run the cooler from AC - but that is not its native mode.

Hope this helps

Bill

[PAUL_R]

3 week trip to grand canyon using as much of route 66, 5day stay at albuquerque balloon festival, 7days at cape cod. numerous fishing trips along louisiana and mississippi gulf cost. the tm refrigerator was outstanding. we also use a coleman ice chest for soft drinks, beer, wine etc. no problems with bending or removing items. one cool night at cape code we were watching old movies and eating ice cream while it was raining out side.

this year we have done over 10,000 miles of camping with the"manor" and only one case of the refrigerator not cooling and the reason for that failure was because i didn't have the "manor" level.

[tipper]

Bill,

How long did you run your thermo electric cooler on the battery without having AC power?

[hal]

We have decided that the more the refrigerator is filled, the less efficient it is.  Things on the door will be barely cool, not ice cold like you like your sodas.  This is probably because the air circulation efficiency is lowered.  Being that the cold comes from the top of the refrigerator, food packages block prevent the colder air currents from reaching the bottom and door area.  We bought a small fan (about three inches tall and about three inches around) from Camping world (about $12.00?). Its color is pale blue aand it  runs on two d cell batteries.  The batteries are supposedly good for 600? hours. The fan is so small that you can barely feel it working.  We placed it on the bottom shelf.  Whenever we are not using the refrigerator (between campouts) we pull the batteries.  The batteries are still good after a six months use.

[Paul_Heuvelhorst]

...However, wife says that the refrig is "inadequate." She says it won't hold enough and to load or unload you have to kneel on the floor. How do you owners out there contend with the small refrig at floor level. [/b]

After 3 years and 16,000 miles in a TM, I will confirm what others have said, the fridge is adequate for 2 people for 5-7 days, between grocery store stops, depending on your preferences for food. We carried milk, OJ, eggs, butter, meat (ground round & chicken) most condiments that require refrigeration, etc. We traveled; we are not weekend campers. We carried lots of packaged & canned foods to supplement the fresh foods.

Unless you are particularly tall (we are 5'10 & 5'9") the bending was not a problem. The only time I was on my knees was when I lit the propane pilot after we set up... oh, when I changed from 110 VAC to 12 VDC for travel, too.

The wife was on her knees while packing the fridge, but rarely while we were traveling.  Most items are handy to reach by bending at the waist.

Good luck.

[tipper]

I'm a TM lover, like most persons here.  And moving up from tent camping, having a refrigerator is our greatest single improvement.

We can all say that the TM refrigerator is adequate and that we all  know tricks on maximizing its utility but when one sees other refers available in conventional RVs in the TM price class, the first post can be appreciated.  

I get by with the TM refer but the fridge size is definitely limiting factor on every trip whenever food and drink are considered.  A larger fridge is highly desirable.

[Windbreaker]

I had never pulled a trailer of any type before the TM but if a newbe like me can pull something and all but forget it is there that makes a few trade-offs worth it.

I agree the fridge is small and I would really like much large holding tanks, black water for sure, but I can and will continue to live with what we have for the ease in towing. Without unlimited funds we all have to make trade offs, my limited experence in towing is what sold me. If you have towed full sized rigs before and are at ease with them maybe that is the way to go.

One other thing you might wish to consider is the type of travel you plan on doing. For me it is 150 miles just to the next town so gas usage was a biggie. We also wanted to see all of the USA and thinking about that many miles and the 4 or 5 mpg difference in a big rig and the TM sure enough locked it in.

[Bill]

Bill,

How long did you run your thermo electric cooler on the battery without having AC power?
Tipper -

Any way you cut it, refrigeration is a power hog. The refrig in the TM draws about 10 amps at 12 volts DC. The TE refrig, being about the same size, probably draws about the same. Either one would suck your battery flat in less than a day if you let it. That's why the TM refrig has a propane setting - to spare the battery. The TE refrig has no propane setting, of course, so I put it in the way-back of the Explorer each day and plugged it into the aux power (cigarette lighter) outlet back there. (It has a nice long cord.) As we drove around seeing the sights, it was powered by the car's electrical system. If we parked the car and went somewhere for 3 or 4 hours, there was no problem with it drawing down the car battery. But if we were going to be out for, say, 12 hours, I was careful to unplug it, despite the fact that the Explorer is supposed to cut off these outlets automatically if the battery voltage drops too much.

Short answer - if you don't have AC power, a TE refrig is not a magic solution. You can't just plug it into the TM battery and leave it. But put it in the car for a few hours each day, and keep the TM refrig on propane, and you're good to go.

Bill

[Bill]

Tipper -

Any way you cut it, refrigeration is a power hog. The refrig in the TM draws about 10 amps at 12 volts DC. The TE refrig, being about the same size, draws about the same. Either one would suck your battery flat in less than a day if you let it ...

Bill
The thermo-electric (TE) refrigerator actually draws 5 amps, only half of my earlier estimate. The TM refrig, unfortunately, still draws 10 amps.

Bill

[tipper]

Bill,

Yes I agree.

This is why I earlier said one needs to have AC power to run a TE cooler.  You apparently misunderstood why I said this.

[Bill]

OK, re Thermoelectric (T-E) coolers, it looks like I have caused some confusion, and I regret that. Let me sum it up, and then back out of the topic altogether.

1. A T-E cooler operates on 12 VDC. Period.

2. Like all refrigerators, a T-E cooler requires a fair amount of power. If you just plug it into a fully charged TM battery, it will use half the battery capacity in about 6 hours. For longer periods than that, you should have an outside source of power to run the cooler and recharge the battery.

3. If you have AC power available, this is a great source of outside power to handle the situation.
a) You can plug the AC power into the TM, and let the trailer's converter recharge the TM battery and run the cooler.
b) Or, if your T-E cooler has an AC adapter (usually optional at extra cost), you can plug the adapter into AC and run the cooler from that.

4. If you don't have AC power available, an equally good source of outside power is the tow vehicle.
a) You can plug the tow vehicle into the TM for a while and let it recharge the TM battery and run the T-E cooler.
b) Or, you can plug the T-E cooler directly into the tow vehicle's accessory power (cigarette lighter) outlet.
Of course, in either case the tow vehicle engine must be running, so taking the cooler along on a day's outing is a good way to keep the cooler cold, and also to have a supply of cold drinks and sandwiches with you as you explore.

5. If you are dry camping for an extended period, and don't want to run the tow vehicle at any time, the T-E cooler will not actively cool your food and drinks. It is still a good, well-insulated passive cooler. Use blue ice.

Last summer we ran a T-E cooler for 10 days straight, WITH access to AC power each day. It worked great. Then we ran the T-E cooler for 10 days straight, WITHOUT access to AC power, using method 4b. It also worked great. Then we did another 10 days WITH AC again. You use what you have.

Hope this clears up any confusion.

Bill

[KB7OUR]

We bought a Koolmate 40 T-E cooler by Igloo from Target, along with the AC converter. As Bill noted, these are really neat coolers to supplement the TM fridge. I was amazed how much ice and/or ice packs we would place into our big ice chest just to keep everything cold for a day. With the T-E cooler we have gained all that extra "ice" space for food items. Also keeps food warm if you reverse the polarity on the plug. We're very pleased with our unit and would recommend it to others as a very convenient way to supplement the TM fridge. It makes a nice staging area when we make a stop at a grocery store and don't want to open up the TM to get to the fridge. Once we're at the campground then we can relocate food items.

Wade  

I want to thank all of you for your responses to my query :).  Wife says that with the TE cooler - TM might be "manageable."

Like everyone, I find the TrailManors are NOT cheap.  Has anyone found a dealer that has TMs in their rental program?  I sure would like to try one before spending $23,000 plus.

Thanks again,

Vic

[KB7OUR]

Vic,

As far as I could research, rental TMs do not exist - period. You could spend 1/2 less than a brand new one to try one out then could likely sell it without much loss. We took the route of playing around with one at the dealer many many times until we were satisfied that it was something that could work for us. I'm constantly amazed when I look at the 3023 fully opened in my driveway, as are my neighbors, then 5 min later I'm pushing it back into the garage with a small hand dolly to keep within the CCNR's. One MAJOR reason why we went with the TM, among others. We know what we can get in a fill size TT for the same money, but those large rigs will only fit in our garage once :P :P.

Wade